<p><a target="_blank" href="https://michaelgarfield.substack.com/subscribe"><strong>Membership</strong></a><strong> | </strong><a target="_blank" href="http://every.org/humansontheloop"><strong>Donations</strong></a><strong> | </strong><a target="_blank" href="https://open.spotify.com/show/2eCYA4ISHLUWbEFOXJ8C5v"><strong>Spotify</strong></a><strong> | </strong><a target="_blank" href="http://youtube.com/michaelgarfield"><strong>YouTube</strong></a><strong> | </strong><a target="_blank" href="https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/humans-on-the-loop/id1152767505"><strong>Apple Podcasts</strong></a></p><p>This week I speak with Rufus Pollock (<a target="_blank" href="https://rufuspollock.com/about">Website</a> | <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/rufuspollock?lang=en">Twitter</a> | <a target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rufus_Pollock">Wikipedia</a>), former Mead Fellow in Economics at the University of Cambridge, entrepreneur, activist, author of <em>Open Revolution</em> and <em>Wiser Societies</em>, RSA Fellow, and co-founder of <a target="_blank" href="http://lifeitself.org">Life Itself</a>, Open Knowledge Foundation, <a target="_blank" href="http://v">Datopian</a>, and <a target="_blank" href="http://secondrenaissance.net">Second Renaissance</a>. Rufus is a key player in the so-called “Liminal Web” and active mapper of the ecosystem of emerging changemaking organizations who, along with his wife Sylvie Barbier and an extensive network of brilliant allies, strives to promote the shifts in consciousness and culture that we need to safely navigate our age of accelerating technology with wiser, weller ways of living together.</p><p>Together we get into the good, bad, and ugly of our nascent planetary culture — the tension between ecological consciousness and economic force, the demands placed on us to reclaim time-tested strategies for community and meaning in a brave new world, the intertwingling of religion and science, and why technological solutions alone are woefully inadequate (however necessary) as we face our crises of collective action. It’s an earnest, soul-searching, thoughtful, and far-reaching extra-long conversation and I hope that you find as much value in it as we did.</p><p><strong>If you enjoy this conversation,</strong> <strong>join the </strong><a target="_blank" href="https://discord.gg/CmJCy6XkP9"><strong>Wisdom x Technology</strong></a><strong> Discord server and</strong> <strong>consider </strong><a target="_blank" href="https://michaelgarfield.substack.com/subscribe"><strong>becoming a member</strong></a><strong> for access to our study groups, community calls, and complete archives.</strong></p><p><strong>Founding members also get access to the entire twenty hours of lecture and discussion from my recent course, </strong><a target="_blank" href="https://weirdosphere.mn.co/spaces/19231614/feed"><strong>How to Live in the Future</strong></a><strong> at Weirdosphere.</strong></p><p><strong>Show Links</strong></p><p>• Explore <a target="_blank" href="http://askfuturefossils.com/">the interactive knowledge garden</a> grown from over 250 episodes• Dig into <a target="_blank" href="http://michaelgarfield.substack.com/podcast">nine years of mind-expanding podcasts</a>• Explore <a target="_blank" href="http://michaelgarfield.substack.com/podcast">the Humans On The Loop archives</a>• Browse <a target="_blank" href="https://bookshop.org/shop/futurefossils">the books we discuss on the show</a> at Bookshop.org• <a target="_blank" href="https://calendly.com/michaelgarfield/consulting">Hire me</a> for speaking or consulting</p><p><strong>Discussed</strong></p><p><a target="_blank" href="https://lifeitself.org/blog/2017/09/10/four-types-of-problem">Four Types of Problem</a></p><p><a target="_blank" href="https://secondrenaissance.net/assets/second-renaissance-whitepaper.pdf%0A%0A">Second Renaissance Whitepaper</a> & <a target="_blank" href="https://secondrenaissance.net/assets/second-renaissance-how-whitepaper-2.pdf">Theory of Change</a></p><p><a target="_blank" href="http://v">Technology as God</a></p><p><a target="_blank" href="http://v">Getting over our Allergy to Religion</a></p><p><a target="_blank" href="https://lifeitself.org/primacy-of-being">The Primacy of Being</a></p><p>David Sloan Wilson - <a target="_blank" href="https://bookshop.org/a/24290/9780226901350">Darwin’s Cathedral</a></p><p><a target="_blank" href="http://michaelgarfield.substack.com/42">William Irwin Thompson</a> - <a target="_blank" href="https://archive.org/details/imaginarylandsca00will">Imaginary Landscape</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20160304084531/http://www.wildriverreview.com/COLUMN/Thinking-Otherwise/The-Digital-Economy-of-Brian-Arthur/William-Irwin-Thompson">The Digital Economy of W. Brian Arthur</a></p><p>Federico Campagna - <a target="_blank" href="http://michaelgarfield.substack.com/prophetic">Prophetic Culture</a></p><p><a target="_blank" href="http://michaelgarfield.substack.com/142">Alex Shakar</a> - Luminarium</p><p>Arthur C. Clarke & Stephen Baxter - <a target="_blank" href="https://bookshop.org/a/24290/9780765322876">The Light of Other Days</a></p><p>Joe Henrich - <a target="_blank" href="https://bookshop.org/a/24290/9781250800077">The WEIRDest People in the World</a></p><p>Jessica Flack - <a target="_blank" href="https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsta.2016.0338">Coarse-Graining as a Downward Causation Mechanism</a></p><p><strong>Mentioned</strong></p><p>Bayo AkomolafeSylvie BarbierLiam KavanaughBret Easton EllisJohn StewartCarl JungDoug RushloffKarl MarxGoetheJamie WhealSteven KotlerKen WilberRobert KeganSuzanne Cook-GreuterPaul LevyGeorge W. BushUrsula K. LeGuinIain McGilchristJim O’ShaughnessyNaval RavikantThich Nhat HanhW. Brian ArthurHazel HendersonJim RuttChristopher AlexanderJamie CurcioJordan PetersonW. B. Yeats</p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://michaelgarfield.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_2">michaelgarfield.substack.com/subscribe</a>