<p>Sebastian and Márton chat with Rod Johnson, the creator of the Spring Framework. Rod tells the story of how Spring was born more than two decades ago, and shares his recent journey of coming back to the JVM and discovering all the fun of being a newcomer to Kotlin.</p><p><strong>Resources:</strong></p><ul> <li><a href="http://www.amazon.com/Expert-One-One-Design-Development/dp/1861007841" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Expert One-on-One J2EE Design and Development: Rod Johnson</a></li> <li><a href="https://spring.io/blog/2012/07/03/oh-the-places-you-ll-go" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Oh the Places You'll Go!</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7z_K-hTTeqI" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Shoulders of Giants: Languages Kotlin Learned From | Andrey Breslav</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uNpmhHwkuQ" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Revamping and Extending Kotlin's Type System | Ross Tate</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBu6zmrZ_50" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Scala in 2018 Keynote | Rod Johnson</a></li> <li><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJDoa42X-wQ" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">But Java has pattern matching! | Alejandro Serrano Mena</a></li></ul><p><strong>Hosts:</strong></p><ul> <li> Sebastian Aigner – <a href="https://sebi.io/" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Website</a> | <a href="https://bsky.app/profile/sebi.io" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Bluesky</a> </li> <li> Márton Braun – <a href="https://zsmb.co" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Website</a> | <a href="https://bsky.app/profile/zsmb.co" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Bluesky</a> </li></ul><p><strong>Guest:</strong></p><ul> <li> Rod Johnson – <a href="https://x.com/springrod" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Twitter</a> | <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnsonroda/" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">LinkedIn</a> </li></ul><p><strong>Timeline:</strong><br />(0:00) Intro<br />(0:52) <a href="https://spring.io/blog/2012/07/03/oh-the-places-you-ll-go" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">The origins of Spring</a><br />(6:40) You need a business model<br />(8:21) Consistency is key<br />(9:39) Sustainable open source<br />(14:22) Parallels with JetBrains and Kotlin<br />(15:29) Rod’s journey around the JVM<br />(20:48) <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7z_K-hTTeqI" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Shoulders of giants</a><br />(22:34) The newcomer experience<br />(24:40) LLMs write great Kotlin<br />(30:34) “You can start without great pain”<br />(33:32) Extension functions<br />(36:15) Too much magic?<br />(37:56) Rod’s feature wishlist<br />(39:37) Versioning and compatibility<br />(41:19) Ecosystems and interop<br />(43:34) <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uNpmhHwkuQ" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Kotlin type system evolution</a><br />(46:27) Kotlin with Spring<br />(52:24) Learning Spring with Kotlin<br />(54:46) <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBu6zmrZ_50" rel="ugc noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Kotlin in 5 years?</a><br />(1:00:39) Rod’s current work<br />(1:03:58) Wrap-up</p>