And as the Kremlin seeks to exploit the transatlantic rift, Ukraine is seeking a way to survive it. We're in uncharted waters folks. On The Power Vertical Podcast this week, host Brian Whitmore speaks with Michael Carpenter, a senior fellow for transatlantic affairs at the International Institute for Strategic Studies who served in the administration of former U.S President Joe Biden as the NSC's Senior Director for Europe as well as the US Ambassador to the OSCE; and Eric Ciaramella, a senior fellow in the Russia and Eurasia program at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace who served as a deputy national intelligence officer for Russia and Eurasia at the U.S. National Intelligence Council.