John and Glenn look at the science of gender, asking Otago Uni's Dr Erik Wibowo about the biological background to our ideas of masculinity and femininity. And while they're in Dunedin, they also catch up with Scout Barbour Evans, a parent who identifies as neither male or female, and who is a vocal advocate for trans rights in New Zealand. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices