Munira Mirza is a former British political advisor who served as Director of the Number 10 Policy Unit under Prime Minister Boris Johnson from 2019 through 2022. She is currently the Director of Civic Future, a non-profit that tries to attract talented people to stand for public office. In this interview, she reflects on her time at the highest levels of British government and delivers a bracing diagnosis of why political leadership has deteriorated across liberal democracies. She explores how short-termism, media incentives, and declining elite formation have driven talented people away from public life. The conversation ranges from Brexit and COVID to meritocracy, civic duty, and what it would take to rebuild a serious governing class.