Blue Sky

Paul Leonardi is an expert in technology management and has developed a deep understanding for why today's digital tools—even those that are helpful—can contribute to our growing sense of exhaustion. Pulling from research he's written about in his book Digital Exhaustion, he explains why this happens and as importantly, what we can do about it.

Chapters:

02:00 Why Digital Exhaustion? Paul Leonardi discusses his 20-year career helping companies implement new technologies and his observation of the increasing dread people feel towards new tools. He highlights how the solutions to digital overload are not working, leading to widespread exhaustion.

04:36 The Types of Digital Switching Paul explains three kinds of digital switching: between modalities (apps), domains of work, and arenas (work/home). He emphasizes that these switches, though seemingly innocuous, cause significant cognitive strain and mental exhaustion due to the brain's reorientation time.

07:20 Cumulative Exhaustion and Control Paul explains that digital exhaustion is a cumulative problem, building slowly over time from seemingly small attention switches.

11:29 Expectations and Response Patterns Paul discusses how people tend to overestimate the urgency of messages and fall into a 'hero symptom' of quick responses, leading to a vicious cycle. He explains how this creates an exhausting game of chase, where individuals try to outdo each other in fast replies.

14:35 Strategies for Managing Expectations Paul suggests asking for clarity on urgency and adopting a philosophy of 'waiting' (one hour, one day, one week) to reset response patterns. He also highlights the effectiveness of out-of-office messages and direct communication in setting realistic expectations and reducing perceived urgency.

20:59 Measuring Digital Exhaustion Paul describes his 'Digital Exhaustion' rating, inspired by the Maslach Burnout Inventory, which measures how much digital tools wear people out. He reveals a precipitous rise in digital exhaustion rates from 2002 to 2022, with major spikes in 2010 (smartphones/social media) and 2021 (pandemic).

26:10 Unforced Errors and Self-Views Paul discusses 'unforced errors' like sleeping with phones in bed and constantly viewing oneself during video calls, which contribute to exhaustion. He explains how the 'self-view' on video platforms is a metaphor for the constant self-curation and inference-making we do across all online platforms, leading to mental fatigue.

31:08 The Exhaustion of Upward Comparison Paul references a 1950s Stanford study on upward comparison and how social media amplifies this, leading to exhaustion from comparing oneself to others' curated ideal lives. He discusses how AI will further exacerbate this issue by creating unrealistic avatars for comparison.

36:07 Antidotes and Small Wins Paul suggests taking online content at face value without extrapolating deeper meanings to combat upward comparison and the stories we create.

42:45 Resonance and Pushback Paul shares that the most pleasing feedback on his book is the distinction between a sustainable approach to digital exhaustion versus unsustainable digital detoxes. The main pushback he receives is about the 'waiting' strategy, with people fearing it will make them seem impolite or ghosting.

Guy Kawasaki has had an amazing life and career. After growing up in Hawaii, he went to California for college and later went on to what was then known as Apple Computer where he was a self-described "brand evangelist" during some of their highest growth and most entrepreneurial years. He describes Steve Jobs as being optimistic almost to the point of being delusional, and working for him has inspired Guy to be interested in mold-breaking people ever since, hence the name of his popular podcast, Remarkable People. He has also written 17 books on a variety of subjects, his latest being Wiser Guy, which was released earlier this year.

Chapters:

00:00 Welcome to Blue Sky Bill Burke introduces Guy Kawasaki as a remarkable guest on Blue Sky, highlighting Guy's background as chief evangelist at Apple and Canva, and his extensive writing. Guy shares his preference for being a podcast guest due to less prep work, contrasting with the host's five-hour preparation time.

03:10 From Hawaii to Stanford Guy recounts his childhood in Kalihi Valley, a lower-middle-income part of Hawaii, and how a public school teacher's advice led him to a private school, then Stanford. He describes feeling immediately at home at Stanford in 1972, despite it being pre-tech, and the campus's amazing atmosphere.

06:17 Apple, Steve Jobs & the 1984 Ad Guy discusses his two stints at Apple, particularly his time in the Macintosh division under Steve Jobs from 1983 to 1987. He reveals the Macintosh team's mission to preserve democracy and freedom through computing and shares the behind-the-scenes story of the iconic 1984 Super Bowl ad, which the board initially wanted to pull.

11:49 Evangelizing Apple & Sales Skills Guy details how Apple evangelized its new operating system in the 1980s through fervor rather than just money, contrasting with the corporate image of IBM. He also shares his 'checkered past' of dropping out of medical, dental, and law school, leading him to an MBA and invaluable sales experience in the jewelry business, which he considers essential.

17:02 Steve Jobs: Visionary & Demanding Guy describes working for Steve Jobs as the most formative experience of his career, calling Jobs a visionary and passionate, albeit demanding and intimidating, leader. He emphasizes that Jobs was a 'mission-driven egoist' who cared only about making the best computer, disregarding personal biases like race or gender.

23:01 Remarkable People Podcast Origins Guy explains his decision to start the 'Remarkable People' podcast, initially inspired by the lucrative ad model of another podcaster, and his realization that his access to remarkable individuals and business experience uniquely positioned him. He highlights the strategic advantage of having prominent guests like Jane Goodall to attract others.

30:08 Jane Goodall: A Source of Hope Guy recounts his personal connection to Jane Goodall, stemming from a TEDx interview, and how she became his first podcast guest. He describes her as the most remarkable person he's interviewed, embodying hope and tireless dedication to her cause, even declining a rest offer at 90 due to 'too much to do.'

36:30 Optimism as a Strategic Advantage Guy discusses optimism as a strategic advantage, asserting that it's crucial for achieving anything significant, combining realism with the belief that challenges can be overcome. He shares his experiences of taking up ice hockey at 44 and surfing at 60, attributing it to a 'growth mindset' and the belief that one is never too old to learn new things.

We all know that huge sums of money are invested in creating new, more effective weapons of war. Brian Abrams sees an opportunity to invest instead in what he calls "peace tech," emerging businesses using technologies and creative methods designed to prevent war from happening in the first place. He's created a new firm, B Ventures, and in this Blue Sky episode he describes with infectious optimism his exciting vision for the future.

Chapters:

00:00 Introduction to Brian Abrams Bill Burke introduces Brian Abrams, founder of B Ventures Group, an investment fund focused on global peacebuilding and conflict resolution through "peace tech." Brian's extensive background in managing over $1 billion in assets and his human-centric investment philosophy are highlighted.

02:09 From Founder to Venture Capitalist Brian shares his career journey, starting as an entrepreneur in India where he experienced failure, which led him to realize his strength in spotting opportunities rather than operationalizing them. He then transitioned to venture capital in Israel, building a fund from $2 million to over $1.2 billion, emphasizing the role of luck and a pivotal moment in fostering peace initiatives.

08:28 The Genesis of Peace Tech Brian reflects on his past experiences, including a startup's condition to include Palestinian teammates during an acquisition, which planted the seed for his current work. He explains his philosophy of using money to serve people and approaching problems from a bottom-up perspective, leading him to focus on peace tech as an alternative to military tech.

10:17 The Rationale for Peace Tech Drawing inspiration from Thich Nhat Hanh's philosophy of 'interbeing,' Brian articulates why war is illogical and a form of collective self-harm. He emphasizes the enormous economic cost of violent conflict, totaling $19 trillion annually, and how venture capital's bottom-up, experimental approach can offer innovative solutions for peacebuilding.

15:28 AI in Crisis Simulation Brian describes an investment in a startup founded by a Harvard researcher who developed an AI-powered crisis simulation platform. This technology aims to anticipate and prevent future conflicts, like potential World War III over Taiwan, by running thousands of scenarios daily, far exceeding traditional war games.

21:32 Business Model for Peace Tech Brian explains the twofold business model for peace tech startups: selling to friendly governments and to companies for competitive landscape analysis. He emphasizes that a for-profit model ensures scalability and continuous funding, unlike grants, allowing for exponential growth and a virtuous cycle to prevent major conflicts.

29:23 Peace Tech: Agile and Ethical Brian highlights the agility of venture-backed peace tech companies compared to traditional government or academic initiatives, citing an example of a startup rapidly forming after the dismantling of the US Institute of Peace. He defines peace tech as anything that preempts, mitigates, or resolves violent conflict, adhering to a 'first do no harm' principle.

34:26 Peace Tech Investments and Ecosystem Brian discusses additional investments, including a company creating digital twins of societies to understand and model civil conflicts like those between Armenia and Azerbaijan. He describes the growing Peace Tech ecosystem, drawing parallels to the private space industry's exponential growth, and aims to build a global community of founders and investors.

41:12 Conclusion and Call to Action Bill Burke reflects on how technology's ability to show the grim reality of war might increase the fervent desire for peace. Brian encourages listeners to connect via LinkedIn and join the Peace Tech community, expressing his strong optimism for the future impact of this movement.

Blue Sky host Bill Burke first met Scott Nash nearly 30 years ago, when both were working in the cable television business. In the years since, Scott has gone on to a successful career in publishing, both as an illustrator and an author, and with his wife Nancy co-founded Illustration Institute on a small island in Maine. In this episode, Scott describes his outgoing, experimental, and optimistic nature and how these traits have led to his remarkable success in publishing, art direction, and non-profit entrepreneurship.

Chapters:

00:00 Introduction & Early Childhood Scott shares that he moved nine times before second grade, which taught him to make new friends and thrive on connection, fueling his optimism and artistic development.

03:47 Education and Early Career Scott Nash discusses his education at the Swain School of Design and Cranbrook, an experimental school that shaped his playful approach to design.

09:05 Early Days of Cable TV Scott highlights how their 'handmade' approach to branding for networks like Nickelodeon, which included assigning the color orange and constantly changing logos, stood out in an industry that traditional executives weren't taking seriously.

14:20 The Flat Stanley Phenomenon Scott Nash discusses his work illustrating Flat Stanley, a book that became a widespread educational phenomenon due to teachers encouraging kids to create and mail their own Flat Stanley figures.

19:16 Illustrating vs. Writing Own Books Scott Nash reflects on the differences and joys of illustrating books for other authors, like Flat Stanley, versus writing and illustrating his own works, such as The High Skies Adventures of Blue Jay the Pirate.

23:05 Defining Illustration & Illustration Institute's Founding Scott Nash defines illustration as 'visual art that enhances a specific narrative,' encompassing comics, graphic novels, and even narrative pottery. He explains how his passion for academia and 'rogue schools' led him to establish the illustration department at Maine College of Art and, later, co-found the Illustration Institute.

31:19 Highlighting Illustrators & Their Impact Scott Nash shares his love for classic children's book illustrators like Garth Williams, known for Stuart Little and Homer Price, and Robert McCloskey, famous for Make Way for Ducklings. He recounts the emotional and intellectual impact of Illustration Institute's exhibitions, which showcase original works and highlight the often-uncredited illustrators behind beloved stories.

34:27 AI's Impact on Creativity and Authenticity Scott Nash discusses the cyclical nature of creative trends, noting a shift from highly creative, handmade works in the early days of cable to a more corporate, homogenized phase. He expresses critical optimism about AI, hoping it will spur a countertrend towards more authentic, handmade creations.

39:59 Ethical Concerns and Public Voice in AI Scott Nash expresses concern about the business-driven rush to implement AI without a clear ethical framework, fearing it could lead to low-quality content and potential harm if not properly regulated.

42:45 Future of Illustration Institute & Closing Scott Nash details the Illustration Institute's future plans, including developing traveling exhibitions for libraries across the country, such as 'The Great State of Illustration in Maine' and the ambitious 'Illustrious Saurus,' which explores dinosaur depictions from paleontology to fantasy. He emphasizes the institute's mission to highlight illustration's critical rigor and broad appeal, connecting Maine's artistic reach with global themes and sharing his childlike enthusiasm for storytelling.

Phil Green has had a successful career in music and sports. For what he describes as his "third act," Phil is now overseeing Follow the Music, a nonprofit in his hometown of Oakland, California. Follow the Music provides artist development, booking and management services to young artists — to shine a light on their talents and bring visibility to the programs that helped develop them.

Chapters:

00:00 Introducing Phil Green and Follow the Music Bill Burke introduces Phil Green, co-founder of Follow the Music, an organization dedicated to fostering young musical talent in Oakland. Phil's extensive background in sports and music, including managing Grammy winner Fantastic Negrito, led him to create this non-profit.

02:05 From Ronnie Lott's Idea to Follow the Music Phil Green shares how a conversation with NFL Hall of Famer Ronnie Lott about a new venue sparked the idea for Follow the Music.

04:32 Fantastic Negrito's Journey and Industry Lessons Phil recounts the incredible comeback story of Fantastic Negrito, who achieved Grammy success at 50 after a major label dropped him and a severe accident. This experience highlighted the music industry's challenges and the importance of artists finding their unique voice, shaping Phil's current work with young people.

08:33 The Genesis and Mission of Follow the Music Phil elaborates on the founding of Follow the Music, emphasizing its mission to help young artists follow their true passions and express their authentic selves.

11:57 Supporting Young Artists and Community Phil explains how Follow the Music collaborates with institutions like the Oakland School for the Arts to develop and showcase young musicians. By leveraging his connections, Phil creates high-visibility opportunities for these artists at major festivals and sporting events, helping them navigate the competitive music landscape.

15:15 Inspiring Hope Through Youthful Energy Phil describes Follow the Music as more than just artist development; it's about connecting the Bay Area to support music education and celebrating the vibrant spirit of young artists. He believes their courage and vulnerability offer hope and inspiration in a divided world, marking his 'third act' dedicated to empowering the next generation.

23:17 Oakland Rising at the Kennedy Center Phil shares the powerful story of Oakland Rising's performance at the Kennedy Center, where the group faced a dilemma due to prior boycotts. Half the band chose to perform as a trio, displaying incredible grace and mutual support despite differing opinions, delivering a stunning and emotionally charged performance.

27:39 Resilience and Reinvention in Oakland Phil addresses the challenges faced by Oakland, including the departure of major sports teams, but emphasizes the city's pride and resilience. He expresses optimism about the burgeoning arts and culture scene and new community-focused sports teams like the Oakland Ballers, which are rebuilding the city's vibrant spirit from the ground up.

31:16 Music's Transformational Power and Life Skills Phil clarifies that Follow the Music's primary goal isn't just to produce professional musicians but to illuminate the transformational power of music for personal growth. He highlights how music education, much like sports, teaches discipline, teamwork, and perseverance, filling a vital gap in youth development.

36:18 Future Vision and Lasting Impact Phil sees Follow the Music as a model for other cities, aiming to uplift existing music education programs rather than replicate them. He reflects on the deep personal reward of helping young people navigate the future through music, emphasizing that the impact on their lives has far surpassed his initial expectations.