FINE is a 4-Letter Word
FINE is a 4-Letter Word

FINE is a 4-Letter Word

Lori Saitz

Overview
Episodes

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What happens when fine is no longer good enough? You’ve got the career, the family, all the outward signs of success. But underneath that competence and capability are quiet questions that won’t leave you alone. How do I build a legacy beyond next quarter’s revenue? Where do I find more meaning? What if I were true to myself? Welcome to Fine is a 4-Letter Word, with host Lori Saitz. Each week, you’ll hear personal stories blended with practical insight What happens when fine is no longer good enough? You’ve got the career, the family, all the outward signs of success. But underneath that competence and capability are quiet questions that won’t leave you alone. How do I build a legacy beyond next quarter’s revenue? Where do I find more meaning? What if I were true to myself? Welcome to Fine is a 4-Letter Word, with host Lori Saitz. Each week, you’ll hear personal stories blended with practical insight from leaders, creators, and change-makers, offering a window into what’s possible when you listen to and honor your heart. We explore what it takes to lead with empathy, vulnerability, gratitude, and courage, especially when everything isn’t fine. You’ll get grounded perspectives and usable tools for moving from stuck, restless, or successful-but-empty into clarity, truth, and passion. None of us knows how much time we have here. So we have to make the most of it. It’s time to live a life that feels like it belongs to you. One thing’s for sure… you’ll never hear—or say—the word “fine” in the same way again., offering a window into what’s possible when you listen to and honor your heart.

Recent Episodes

225. Sued for $60 Million. Not Guilty. with Shane Barker
APR 23, 2026
225. Sued for $60 Million. Not Guilty. with Shane Barker
What would you do if you woke up one day to find the California Attorney General was suing you for $60 million — and you hadn't done anything wrong? That's exactly what happened to Shane Barker, digital marketing expert and founder of TraceFuse.ai, and the way he navigated it says everything about who he is.Shane was shaped by the loving, free-spirited energy of his family in Sacramento, California. It was a household with hippie leanings where kindness and connection were valued above all. Though he acknowledges that no childhood is perfect, Shane credits his upbringing with teaching him resilience and the ability to view life’s challenges through a lens of growth and learning. He’s a big believer that every experience, even the tough ones, is an opportunity to evolve.This mindset was severely tested when Shane found himself at the center of a high-profile, $60 million lawsuit from the California Attorney General. He was the owner and marketing leader of a real estate company created to fight predatory lending and help vulnerable homeowners after the 2008 housing crash. The company grew rapidly, making waves by standing up to big banks and brokers who had exploited countless families. But the very system he sought to challenge turned its sights on him, launching a very public PR battle, freezing his bank accounts, and painting him as a villain in the court of public opinion.The experience was a brutal, wild ride. He was working 18-20 hours a day, 40 pounds heavier, running on energy drinks and determination, endlessly battling negative narratives online and in the media, trying to protect his family from the chaos while simultaneously fighting for his reputation and his business. He was showing up and arguing with strangers online who weren't even customers and confronting the reality that truth isn’t always what gets broadcast or believed.He thought he was winning. But he finally realized he was losing. Losing his health, his time, his energy, and his opportunity to be at his son's baseball games.Throughout it all, Shane remained steadfast, refusing to flee or hide. He eventually realized that other people were living rent-free in his head, and he was handing them the keys. He stopped fighting every battle on the internet, started walking 10 miles a day, and began asking a very different question: what can I learn from this?When we spoke, Shane and his family were beginning a 45-day vacation in a small little beach town in Oregon. He’s come a long way from what he called Shane 1.0 who was in a room with coffee, going to war every day. Now he’s looking at animals and enjoying life and continuing to grow.Hype Song:Shane’s hype song is "Ain't No Sunshine" by Bill WithersResources:Shane Barker’s website: https://shanebarker.com/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shanebarker/Invitation from Lori:This episode is sponsored by Zen Rabbit.Smart business leaders know trust is the foundation of every great workplace. And in today’s hybrid and fast-moving work culture, trust isn’t built in quarterly town halls or the occasional Slack message. It’s built through consistent, clear, and HUMAN communication.Companies and leaders TALK about the importance of connection and community. And it’s easy to believe your organization is doing a great job of maintaining an awesome corporate culture. Because you’ve got annual all-hands and open door policies, and “fun" team-building events.But let's be real. Leaders who are serious about building real trust are finding better ways to strengthen culture, create connection, and foster community.That's where I come in. Forward thinking companies are hiring me to produce internal/private podcasts. To bring leadership and employees together through authentic stories, real conversations, and meaningful connections. Think of it as your old-school printed company newsletter - reinvented for the modern workforce. I KNOW, what a cool idea, right?!If you run, work for, or know of a company that wants to upgrade communication, facilitate connections, build community, and maintain culture, let's chat. Message me at Lori@ZenRabbit dot com.Because when people feel heard, they engage.
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48 MIN
224. Do It Scared with Vanessa McDowell Atlas
APR 16, 2026
224. Do It Scared with Vanessa McDowell Atlas
What if the secret to being an exceptional leader isn't about being stronger, working harder, or having all the answers — but about being the first one in the room to say *I need a break*?Sounds counterintuitive, right? Maybe even a little reckless. But stick with me here.Vanessa McDowell-Atlas grew up deeply rooted in the values of faith, family, and community, shaped by her upbringing in Madison, Wisconsin. The McDowell household instilled a strong connection to God, encouraged giving back, and fostered authenticity. These ideals were lived out every day.Authenticity, though often overused in today’s cultural landscape, holds a deeper resonance for Vanessa. She notes that the pressure to perform and conform is magnified by technology and social media, where curated lives and even AI-generated content can make “real” feel elusive. The craving for genuine connection, she believes, is stronger than ever because so much of what’s presented isn’t authentic at all. Growing up without the noise of constant screens, Vanessa learned the value of face-to-face relationships and the grounding that comes from truly being seen and heard.From these foundations, Vanessa’s journey into leadership and service was anything but random. Each step in her career was guided by faith and an intentional sense of purpose. She describes her path as a series of conscious choices—listening, reflecting, and praying to discern where she was meant to serve. Even when the path was uncertain or intimidating, she adopted the mantra “do it scared,” understanding that courage grows in the doing, not the waiting.She's a natural introvert. She deals with anxiety. And somehow, she ended up as the CEO of a century-old organization — becoming the first Black woman in its entire history to hold that role. No pressure or anything.She didn't stumble into it either. Her boss announced she was leaving, tapped Vanessa on the shoulder for the interim role, and Vanessa thought, *sure, six months, I can hold it down.* Spoiler: it became permanent. And what she inherited? Her words — a mess. On top of that, she was carrying what she calls "three isms" — racism, sexism, and ageism — every single day, before she even opened her laptop.So she did what a lot of leaders do. She worked twice as hard, carried the load silently, and told everyone she was fine.Burnout came for her anyway… because it always does. But here's where Vanessa's story takes a turn most leaders never make: she told her team the truth, took two weeks completely off, and came back so recharged that her staff literally noticed the difference and asked why she didn't do it sooner.By giving herself permission to pause, rest, and ask for support, Vanessa not only transformed her approach to her own well-being but also modeled a new kind of leadership for her team and community. As she puts it, being a “strong Black woman” is not about never taking a break. It’s about having the wisdom to know when to recharge, so you can serve from a place of wholeness.Oh, and did I mention she's also a DJ on the side? Yeah. DJ Ace is in the building.Vanessa is now a transformational leadership coach, and in this conversation, she's about to share what it actually looks like to lead from your values, do it scared, and give yourself, along with everyone watching you, permission to be human.ResourcesVanessa McDowell-Atlas’ website: vmatransformationalcoaching.comLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/vanessarmcdowellHype SongVanessa’s hype song is You've Been So Faithful by Eddie James & The Phoenix Mass Choir https://youtu.be/m28IBrcgSIo?si=kE2OV_-o0msqb7vCInvitation from Lori:This episode is sponsored by Zen Rabbit.Smart business leaders know trust is the foundation of every great workplace. And in today’s hybrid and fast-moving work culture, trust isn’t built in quarterly town halls or the occasional Slack message. It’s built through consistent, clear, and HUMAN communication.Companies and leaders TALK about the importance of connection and community. And it’s easy to believe your organization is doing a great job of maintaining an awesome corporate culture. Because you’ve got annual all-hands and open door policies, and “fun" team-building events.But let's be real. Leaders who are serious about building real trust are finding better ways to strengthen culture, create connection, and foster community.That's where I come in. Forward thinking companies are hiring me to produce internal/private podcasts. To bring leadership and employees together through authentic stories, real conversations, and meaningful connections. Think of it as your old-school printed company newsletter - reinvented for the modern workforce. I KNOW, what a cool idea, right?!If you run, work for, or know of a company that wants to upgrade communication, facilitate connections, build community, and maintain culture, let's chat. Message me at Lori@ZenRabbit dot com.Because when people feel heard, they engage.
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37 MIN
223. I Can't Get Off the Highway with Melissa Coloton
APR 2, 2026
223. I Can't Get Off the Highway with Melissa Coloton
What happens when your life looks successful and you keep telling yourself it is… but then you find yourself pulled over on the side of the highway with clammy hands and unable to breathe? Growing up in a loving, hard-working family deeply rooted in farming traditions, Melissa Coloton learned early on the importance of honesty, compassion, and the power of expressing love. Unlike most families, hers openly verbalized affection. “I love you” was the punctuation to every goodbye. This warmth, however, was balanced with discipline and high expectations. Because Melissa’s mother became a parent at sixteen, she was vigilantly determined to give her children the best possible chance, insisting on hard work, achievement, and a relentless pursuit of success. Melissa spent 20 years building a successful career in sales. She was really good at it. The kind of good that keeps you locked in. Promotions, performance, steady income… all the things that say, “stay right here.” And for a long time, she did. But underneath that success was constant pressure to get it right. To not mess up. To keep proving herself. What looked like ambition on the outside was really a fear of failure she didn’t even recognize at the time. That panic attack on the highway left her feeling lost, disconnected, and unraveling, fearful that she’d die without ever honoring her true purpose. With the help of a life coach and the practice of self-compassion, Melissa learned to listen to her own needs, confront the chronic sources of anxiety, and eventually gained the tools to manage and move through challenging emotions. Eventually she was able to unlock the “golden handcuffs” of her sales career and step into work that centers around honoring yourself and creating aligned success so you can avoid the kind of burnout that she experienced. We’re talking about how technology and societal shifts have fostered loneliness and a loss of communal support. But our conversation is optimistic about the resurgence of retreats, gratitude dinners, and analog gatherings. Listen in to hear the whole story.Resources Website: www.melissacoloton.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissa-coloton-coach/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/melissa_coloton/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61568472840753 Hype Song Unstoppable by Sia https://open.spotify.com/track/1yvMUkIOTeUNtNWlWRgANS?si=a2507f11148f41b1 Invitation from Lori:This episode is sponsored by Zen Rabbit.Smart business leaders know trust is the foundation of every great workplace. And in today’s hybrid and fast-moving work culture, trust isn’t built in quarterly town halls or the occasional Slack message. It’s built through consistent, clear, and HUMAN communication.Companies and leaders TALK about the importance of connection and community. And it’s easy to believe your organization is doing a great job of maintaining an awesome corporate culture. Because you’ve got annual all-hands and open door policies, and “fun" team-building events.But let's be real. Leaders who are serious about building real trust are finding better ways to strengthen culture, create connection, and foster community.That's where I come in. Forward thinking companies are hiring me to produce internal/private podcasts. To bring leadership and employees together through authentic stories, real conversations, and meaningful connections. Think of it as your old-school printed company newsletter - reinvented for the modern workforce. I KNOW, what a cool idea, right?!If you run, work for, or know of a company that wants to upgrade communication, facilitate connections, build community, and maintain culture, let's chat. Message me at Lori@ZenRabbit dot com.Because when people feel heard, they engage.
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37 MIN
222. Unshakeable Relief with Janice DaCosta
MAR 26, 2026
222. Unshakeable Relief with Janice DaCosta
What happens when the thing you pride yourself on most… is the very thing quietly breaking you? Janice DaCosta grew up in a world where excellence wasn’t optional. You hold it together. You don’t fall apart. You make it work—no matter what. Until one day, standing in front of a mirror with scissors in her hand, she couldn’t hold it together anymore. What followed was a complete Control, Alt, Delete reset. Raised in a family of serial entrepreneurs with deep roots on Wall Street, Janice DaCosta grew up learning values centered around excellence, rigorous work ethic, and community upliftment. Love was at the core, but hustle was integral too. Janice’s professional journey began in the corporate world, navigating high-pressure environments across multiple continents as a global logistics leader. She excelled in male-dominated environments, but behind the scenes, it was a different story. She was holding together a marriage that wasn’t working. Showing up strong, being everything to everyone in every role she played. And quietly, she was unraveling. That pivotal “mirror moment” happened on a regular day when the façade finally cracked. It became the catalyst for radical change. She realized true failure wasn’t in letting go and not being perfect. It was in sacrificing herself at the altar of perfection. Thus began her long, messy, honest healing process. She started recording raw, unfiltered conversations with herself on video through which she allowed herself to unpack, witness, and process what she’d been holding back for years. This practice of speaking aloud, instead of shoving the emotions down, helped her cultivate self-trust and gave her the courage to finally seek support from others. Through this introspective journey, Janice unlocked the transformative power of “unshakable relief.” She learned to define her worth outside productivity, to let go of shame, and to give herself permission to feel all the emotions that make us human. That journey and its hard-won wisdom are now at the heart of her latest book on emotional wealth, which reimagines the concept of “pay yourself first.” Keep listening to hear what it sounds like when someone who “has it all together” finally admits… yeah, I don’t—and can’t keep pretending I do. Because you might recognize yourself here. Hype Song Janice’s hype song is Run the World (Girls)- Beyonce https://youtu.be/Xqo08TXbxWQ?si=jvYs5OeWT25608Wr Resources Janice DaCosta’s website: iamjaniceclaire.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/janicedacosta Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/iamjaniceclaire Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/iamjaniceclaire Invitation from Lori:This episode is sponsored by Zen Rabbit.Smart business leaders know trust is the foundation of every great workplace. And in today’s hybrid and fast-moving work culture, trust isn’t built in quarterly town halls or the occasional Slack message. It’s built through consistent, clear, and HUMAN communication.Companies and leaders TALK about the importance of connection and community. And it’s easy to believe your organization is doing a great job of maintaining an awesome corporate culture. Because you’ve got annual all-hands and open door policies, and “fun" team-building events.But let's be real. Leaders who are serious about building real trust are finding better ways to strengthen culture, create connection, and foster community.That's where I come in. Forward thinking companies are hiring me to produce internal/private podcasts. To bring leadership and employees together through authentic stories, real conversations, and meaningful connections. Think of it as your old-school printed company newsletter - reinvented for the modern workforce. I KNOW, what a cool idea, right?!If you run, work for, or know of a company that wants to upgrade communication, facilitate connections, build community, and maintain culture, let's chat. Message me at Lori@ZenRabbit dot com.Because when people feel heard, they engage.
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38 MIN
221. Connection Is the Real Life Hack
MAR 16, 2026
221. Connection Is the Real Life Hack
We’re more connected than ever… and more lonely than ever. Because connected online is very different than connected offline.In this solo episode, I'm exploring the quiet epidemic of loneliness and why it shows up in places most leaders overlook.If you’re interested in being successful – whether you’re running a business or working for someone – no matter what your definition of success is… and you want to amplify or upgrade your abilities, this episode is for you. If you’re interested in living longer without having to eat kale and work out two hours a day, seven days a week, this episode is for you.More than 10 years ago, Surgeon General Dr. Vivek Murthy uncovered an epidemic of loneliness in the U.S. What surprised him the most was the degree to which people described feeling lonely. And the diversity of people affected – all genders, all ages, all levels of education and professionalism and wealth.People were reporting they didn’t feel like they belonged. And people felt embarrassed and ashamed to admit they felt lonely. Because they didn’t want to appear needy or inadequate. Because of course, in America, we’re all about independence and self-sufficiency.Nothing has changed since then. If anything, these findings have only intensified in the past decade and were especially exacerbated by pandemic times.When people don’t feel seen, known, or supported, collaboration suffers, trust erodes, and work becomes heavier than it needs to be.The truth is, humans aren’t designed to operate like machines behind screens all day. Real connection fuels creativity, resilience, and engagement. It also plays a surprising role in how long and how well we live.If you want a stronger culture, better communication, and a team that actually enjoys working together, this episode will give you a place to start.Resources:My Website: https://ZenRabbit.com/LinkedIn: https://zenrabbit.com/linkedin/Facebook: https://zenrabbit.com/facebook/Instagram: https://zenrabbit.com/instagram/Visit the “FINE is a 4-Letter Word” store at https://zenrabbit.printful.meInvitation from Lori:This episode is sponsored by Zen Rabbit.Smart business leaders know trust is the foundation of every great workplace. And in today’s hybrid and fast-moving work culture, trust isn’t built in quarterly town halls or the occasional Slack message. It’s built through consistent, clear, and HUMAN communication.Companies and leaders TALK about the importance of connection and community. And it’s easy to believe your organization is doing a great job of maintaining an awesome corporate culture. Because you’ve got annual all-hands and open door policies, and “fun" team-building events.But let's be real. Leaders who are serious about building real trust are finding better ways to strengthen culture, create connection, and foster community.That's where I come in. Forward thinking companies are hiring me to produce internal/private podcasts. To bring leadership and employees together through authentic stories, real conversations, and meaningful connections. Think of it as your old-school printed company newsletter - reinvented for the modern workforce. I KNOW, what a cool idea, right?!If you run, work for, or know of a company that wants to upgrade communication, facilitate connections, build community, and maintain culture, let's chat. Message me at Lori@ZenRabbit dot com.Because when people feel heard, they engage.
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18 MIN