Wallfacer Podcast

<p><strong>EPISODE DESCRIPTION:</strong></p><p>Today’s guest is Octave Mesnard, Head of Strategy and Consumer Products at Jumper Exchange. We discuss Jumper’s evolution from a thin cross-chain swap interface into a full on-chain consumer hub, the real challenges of building consumer DeFi products at the right time, and why Octave thinks the multi-chain future will consolidate around far fewer chains than anyone expected.</p><p><strong>GUEST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* Octave Mesnard: <a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/octavionotpunk">https://twitter.com/octavionotpunk</a></p><p>* Jumper Exchange: <a target="_blank" href="https://jumper.exchange/">https://jumper.exchange</a></p><p>* Jumper Exchange on X: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/JumperExchange">https://x.com/JumperExchange</a></p><p>* Jumper Earn: <a target="_blank" href="https://jumper.exchange/earn">https://jumper.exchange/earn</a></p><p></p><p><strong>Learn how Jumper leverages the vaults.fyi API: </strong><a target="_blank" href="https://docs.vaults.fyi/general/case-studies/jumper-earn"><strong>https://docs.vaults.fyi/general/case-studies/jumper-earn</strong></a></p><p></p><p><strong>HOST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* Ryan Rodenbaugh: <a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/ryanrodenbaugh">https://twitter.com/ryanrodenbaugh</a></p><p>* Vaults.fyi: <a target="_blank" href="https://app.vaults.fyi/">https://app.vaults.fyi/</a></p><p>* Build with our APIs: <a target="_blank" href="https://docs.vaults.fyi/">https://docs.vaults.fyi</a></p><p><strong>SUBSCRIBE:</strong></p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/wallfacer-podcast/id1709530326">Apple</a> </p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://open.spotify.com/show/2PNkM1JiIZCvvPLfdRYrb4">Spotify</a> </p><p>* YouTube: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs">https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs</a></p><p>* Substack: <a target="_blank" href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast">https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast</a></p><p><strong>TIMESTAMPS:</strong></p><p><strong>[00:00] Introduction</strong></p><p><strong>[00:39] What was your initial foray into crypto?</strong></p><p><strong>[02:17] Are there any parallels between catastrophe bonds and crypto insurance?</strong></p><p><strong>[05:43] Tell us about Valha and Kook Exchange — what did you set out to solve?</strong></p><p><strong>[09:10] You had both an API and a consumer interface — was that intentional?</strong></p><p><strong>[12:05] Before joining LiFi, you were already working with them. How did that come about and how did you end up joining?</strong></p><p><strong>[13:34] When you joined, did you already have a vision for what you wanted Jumper to become?</strong></p><p><strong>[15:23] How do you think about where Jumper goes from here — browser, desktop, mobile?</strong></p><p><strong>[19:43] Does the Robinhood comparison resonate — one place where users manage everything?</strong></p><p><strong>[22:07] Who actually is the “normie” user in crypto?</strong></p><p><strong>[23:42] So Jumper started as a thin layer on LiFi’s stack — is Earn the attempt to thicken that?</strong></p><p><strong>[26:21] How have you thought about curation on Jumper Earn — what gets listed and what stays out?</strong></p><p><strong>[29:10] How do you think about risk scoring more broadly across DeFi?</strong></p><p><strong>[34:46] What are your concerns around RWAs coming into DeFi?</strong></p><p><strong>[37:28] How do you view the competitive landscape for swapping and bridging today?</strong></p><p><strong>[40:22] How did you think about working with vaults.fyi and how do you approach partnerships generally?</strong></p><p><strong>[42:01] Outside of your role at Jumper, what’s catching your attention in DeFi right now?</strong></p><p><strong>[44:22] You work in interoperability — do you have a contrarian view on the multi-chain future?</strong></p><p><strong>[48:58] What is the origin of </strong><a target="_blank" href="https://substack.com/profile/103728946-octavio-not-punk">Octavio Not Punk</a> </p><p></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">wallfacerlabs.substack.com</a>

<p>Today’s guest is Sébastien Derivaux, co-founder of Steakhouse Financial. We discuss the evolution of real-world assets in DeFi from MakerDAO’s pioneering experiments to today’s institutional-grade credit infrastructure, the recent mF-ONE private credit controversy and what it reveals about risk management in tokenized assets, and how Steakhouse built a $1B+ vault curation business on Morpho. Seb shares unfiltered lessons from five years of bringing TradFi credit on-chain—from Société Générale’s groundbreaking tokenized bond deal to defaults to launching Grove as a Sky Star allocating $1B into CLO strategies.</p><p><strong>GUEST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* Sébastien Derivaux: <a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/SebVentures">https://twitter.com/SebVentures</a></p><p>* Steakhouse Financial: <a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/SteakhouseFi">https://twitter.com/SteakhouseFi</a></p><p>* Steakhouse Financial Website: https://steakhouse.financial</p><p><strong>HOST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* Ryan Rodenbaugh: <a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/ryanrodenbaugh">https://twitter.com/ryanrodenbaugh</a></p><p>* Vaults.fyi: https://vaults.fyi</p><p>* Vaults.fyi X: https://x.com/vaultsfyi</p><p>* Wallfacer X: https://x.com/wallfacerlabs</p><p><strong>SUBSCRIBE TO WALLFACER PODCAST AND SHARE WITH FRIENDS:</strong></p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/wallfacer-podcast/id1709530326">Apple</a> </p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://open.spotify.com/show/2PNkM1JiIZCvvPLfdRYrb4">Spotify</a> </p><p>* YouTube: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs">https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs</a></p><p>* Substack: <a target="_blank" href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast">https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast</a></p><p><strong>TIMESTAMPS:</strong></p><p>* <strong>[00:00] Introduction & Background</strong></p><p>* <strong>[02:20] MakerDAO’s Early RWA Experiments: Société Générale, Centrifuge & Lessons Learned</strong></p><p>* <strong>[10:02] The Economics of RWAs: Cost Savings, Efficiency & What Actually Works On-Chain</strong></p><p>* <strong>[16:31] Why Crypto Needs RWAs: Yield Sources, Composability & Liquidity Challenges</strong></p><p>* <strong>[24:20] The mF-ONE Controversy: What Happened & How to Think About Private Credit Risk</strong></p><p>* <strong>[31:00] Commercial Break</strong></p><p>* <strong>[34:17] Risk Management Philosophy: Lenders vs. Investors & Diversification Strategy</strong></p><p>* <strong>[42:46] Comparing RWA Risk to Crypto Collateral & Evolution of Market Perception</strong></p><p>* <strong>[48:53] Building Steakhouse: Three Business Pillars & Becoming a Morpho Curator</strong></p><p>* <strong>[51:45] The Future of Curation: Market Structure, Competition & Traditional Finance Entry</strong></p><p>* <strong>[57:08] Vault Governance: Non-Custodial Design & How Morpho Captures Value</strong></p><p>* <strong>[59:58] Grove Protocol & Sky’s Star System: Decentralized Allocation Strategy</strong></p><p>* <strong>[1:04:33] Looking Ahead: Term Lending, Yield Curves & 10-Year Vision</strong></p><p></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">wallfacerlabs.substack.com</a>

<p>Today's guest is Andrew Keys, co-founder and chairman of The Ether Machine and managing partner of DARMA Capital. We discuss why crypto treasury companies offer superior returns to ETFs through active yield generation, the structural limitations preventing ETFs from capturing Ethereum's full economic value, and Andrew's $654 million bet on Ethereum's future as the infrastructure for a decentralized internet. Andrew also shares lessons from a decade building Ethereum's institutional adoption and why clean corporate structures matter more than speed to market.</p><p><strong>GUEST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* Andrew Keys: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/AK_EtherMachine">https://x.com/AK_EtherMachine</a></p><p>* The Ether Machine: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/TheEtherMachine">https://x.com/TheEtherMachine</a></p><p>* DARMA Capital: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/darmacapital">https://x.com/darmacapital</a></p><p><strong>HOST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* Ryan Rodenbaugh: <a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/ryanrodenbaugh">https://twitter.com/ryanrodenbaugh</a></p><p>* Vaults.fyi: https://vaults.fyi</p><p><strong>SUBSCRIBE SECTION:</strong> <strong>Subscribe to Wallfacer Podcast and share with friends:</strong></p><p>* Apple/Spotify: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.wallfacer.io/podcast">https://www.wallfacer.io/podcast</a></p><p>* YouTube: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs">https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs</a></p><p>* Substack: <a target="_blank" href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast">https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast</a></p><p><strong>TIMESTAMPS:</strong></p><p>* <strong>[00:18] Andrew's Background & Early Ethereum Journey</strong></p><p>* <strong>[05:39] ETFs vs Digital Asset Treasuries (DATs)</strong></p><p>* <strong>[08:15] North Star Metric: Ether Concentration Per Share</strong></p><p>* <strong>[09:54] Institutional Investor Education & Market Response</strong></p><p>* <strong>[10:25] Ethereum's Evolving Narrative & Stablecoin Product-Market Fit</strong></p><p>* <strong>[12:40] Ethereum's Market Dominance in High-Quality Liquid Assets</strong></p><p>* <strong>[16:57] DARMA Capital's Institutional Staking Business</strong></p><p>* <strong>[20:35] Why Go Public: Philosophy vs Opportunity</strong></p><p>* <strong>[22:46] Regulatory Environment & Long-Term Vision</strong></p><p>* <strong>[23:54] Clean Corporate Structure Strategy</strong></p><p>* <strong>[28:10] The Future of Altcoin DATs & Market Sustainability</strong></p><p>* <strong>[29:36] Lessons Learned: From Naive Decentralization to Meeting People Where They Are</strong></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">wallfacerlabs.substack.com</a>

<p>Today's guest is Rob Montgomery, co-founder and CEO of InfiniFi. We discuss how fractional reserve banking principles can revolutionize DeFi yields, the symbiotic relationship between InfiniFi and Pendle, and why traditional finance assets may finally have a compelling reason to migrate on-chain. </p><p>Rob shares insights on building automated asset-liability matching systems and his vision for bringing TradFi capital into crypto through superior yield optimization.</p><p><strong>GUEST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* Rob Montgomery: <a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/RobAnon94">https://twitter.com/RobAnon94</a></p><p>* InfiniFi: <a target="_blank" href="https://infinifi.xyz/">https://infinifi.xyz</a></p><p>* InfiniFi on X: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/infiniFi_">https://x.com/infiniFi_</a></p><p><strong>HOST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* Ryan Rodenbaugh: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/ryanrodenbaugh">https://x.com/ryanrodenbaugh</a></p><p>* Vaults.fyi: <a target="_blank" href="https://vaults.fyi/">https://vaults.fyi</a></p><p>* vaults.fyi on X: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/vaultsfyi">https://x.com/vaultsfyi</a></p><p><strong>Subscribe to Wallfacer Podcast and share with friends:</strong></p><p>* Apple / Spotify: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.wallfacer.io/podcast">https://www.wallfacer.io/podcast</a></p><p>* YouTube: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs">https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs</a></p><p>* Substack: <a target="_blank" href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast">https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast</a></p><p><strong>TIMESTAMPS:</strong></p><p>* <strong>[01:01] InfiniFi's Timeline & Rapid Growth</strong></p><p>* <strong>[02:47] Capital Composition - Retail vs Institutional</strong></p><p>* <strong>[05:52] What is InfiniFi?</strong></p><p>* <strong>[08:00] How Duration Users Get Higher Yields</strong></p><p>* <strong>[09:31] Tranching Analogy & How It Works</strong></p><p>* <strong>[10:33] Portfolio Selection & Governance Process</strong></p><p>* <strong>[17:58] Complex Governance Structure Vision</strong></p><p>* <strong>[21:24] Risk Assessment & Due Diligence Process</strong></p><p>* <strong>[23:34] Duration Asset Adoption in Crypto</strong></p><p>* <strong>[27:59] The Pendle Relationship & Symbiosis</strong></p><p>* <strong>[29:38] Background on Resonate vs Pendle</strong></p><p>* <strong>[31:03] Why Haven't Competitors Built This?</strong></p><p>* <strong>[33:14] Network Effects & Defensibility</strong></p><p>* <strong>[34:35] RWA Vision & Tokenizer Strategy</strong></p><p>* <strong>[39:14] Revenue Model & Performance Fees</strong></p><p>* <strong>[40:54] What Haven't I Asked About?</strong></p><p>* <strong>[41:22] Success Metrics Beyond TVL</strong></p><p></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">wallfacerlabs.substack.com</a>

<p>Today's guests are John Morrow, COO and Co-founder of Gauntlet, and Holt Butler, Product Lead for Gauntlet USD Alpha. We discuss Gauntlet's evolution from protocol risk consultants to direct vault operators managing $700M+, the emerging "vault curator" role in DeFi, and how they're bridging TradFi and DeFi through products like gtUSDa. We also explore the competitive dynamics reshaping DeFi lending markets and why automation beats governance for capital allocation.</p><p><strong>GUEST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* John Morrow: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/jmo_mx">https://x.com/jmo_mx</a></p><p>* Holt Butler: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/0xhotl">https://x.com/0xhotl</a></p><p>* Gauntlet: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/gauntlet_xyz">https://x.com/gauntlet_xyz</a></p><p>* https://gauntlet.xyz</p><p>* Gauntlet USD Alpha: <a target="_blank" href="https://app.gauntlet.xyz/vaults/gtusda">https://app.gauntlet.xyz/vaults/gtusda</a></p><p><strong>HOST LINKS:</strong></p><p>* Ryan Rodenbaugh: <a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/ryanrodenbaugh">https://twitter.com/ryanrodenbaugh</a></p><p>* Vaults.fyi: <a target="_blank" href="https://app.vaults.fyi/">https://vaults.fyi</a></p><p>* gtUSDa on vaults.fyi: https://app.vaults.fyi/opportunity/base/0x000000000001CdB57E58Fa75Fe420a0f4D6640D5</p><p>* Wallfacer: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/wallfacerlabs">https://x.com/wallfacerlabs</a></p><p><strong>SUBSCRIBE SECTION:</strong> <strong>Subscribe to Wallfacer Podcast and share with friends:</strong></p><p>* Apple / Spotify: https://www.wallfacer.io/podcast</p><p>* YouTube: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs">https://www.youtube.com/@WallfacerLabs</a></p><p>* Substack: <a target="_blank" href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast">https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com/s/podcast</a></p><p><strong>TIMESTAMPS:</strong></p><p>* <strong>[00:13] Gauntlet's Evolution: From Risk Models to Vault Management</strong></p><p>* <strong>[07:14] Defining the Vault Curator Role</strong></p><p>* <strong>[14:50] Behind the Scenes: Vault Management Operations</strong></p><p>* <strong>[17:54] Aera Protocol & Gauntlet USD Alpha Launch</strong></p><p>* <strong>[25:20] Institutional vs Retail Capital Allocation</strong></p><p>* <strong>[33:04] Customer Relationships & Platform Ownership</strong></p><p>* <strong>[36:56] Real World Assets & Cross-Chain Strategies</strong></p><p>* <strong>[46:25] DeFi Lending Competition: Morpho vs Aave</strong></p><p>* <strong>[49:26] Gaming, Tokenized Assets & Future DeFi Use Cases</strong></p><p></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://wallfacerlabs.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">wallfacerlabs.substack.com</a>