Immigrantly Podcast

On the morning of February 8, 2024, Pakistan went to vote, and the government switched off mobile phone service across the country. Weeks earlier, the Supreme Court had ruled that Imran Khan's party, PTI, could not use its election symbol, a cricket bat. Khan himself was in jail, convicted in three cases in the last ten days before the vote. When the results came in, candidates backed by his party had won more seats than anyone else. They still didn't form the government. Saadia Khan talks with Anas Mallick, an Islamabad-based journalist who covers diplomacy, militancy and conflict. Anas spent years as Pakistan bureau chief for the Indian news channel WION, explaining Pakistan to India every day. He is now Pakistan bureau chief for AsiaOne News and writes for Daily Times. He has interviewed both Imran Khan and Bilawal Bhutto Zardari. In this episode: What it's like to report an election when the phones go dead Why Pakistani ballots have pictures, and what it meant to lose the bat How Form 45 and Form 47 became the center of the rigging fight The Rawalpindi official who confessed to rigging, then took it back How you win the most seats and still end up in opposition Why women registered in record numbers but turned out at lower rates than men What the diaspora gets wrong about elections back home What the US could learn from Pakistan's election day, and what would make a Pakistani voter laugh at ours. Follow Anas Mallick on X and Instagram: @AnasMallick You can connect with Saadia on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠IG ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@itssaadiak⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Email:[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Host & Producer: Saadia Khan I Content Writer: Saadia Khan I Editorial Review: Shei Yu I Sound Designer & Editor: Lou Raskin I Immigrantly Theme Music: Simon Hutchinson | Other Music: Epidemic Sound I Cover art for the Series: Sarah DiMichele Immigrantly Podcast is an Immigrantly Media Production. For advertising inquiries, contact us at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT (Belong On Your Own Terms) ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠is the next step. It’s our new app, designed to help you think through identity, culture, ambition, relationships, and the stories we carry with guided reflections, prompts, and frameworks developed over years of conversations on this show. It’s thoughtful. It’s challenging. And honestly, it’s the kind of space many of us wish existed earlier in our lives. If you’re ready to go deeper than the podcast, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and start the journey. Don't forget to subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Immigrantly Uninterrupted⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠for insightful podcasts. Follow us on social media for updates and behind-the-scenes content. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

At this year's UN General Assembly, whole delegations walked out as Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu took the podium. Two days earlier, President Trump told the world he could make a deal with Iran or "annihilate the Islamic Republic," and called on countries to quit the International Criminal Court. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, denied a U.S. visa for the second year in a row, had to address the Assembly by video. In this solo episode, Saadia Khan asks what that building is actually for. She goes back to 1945 and a Charter that opens with "We the peoples," and to the veto that let the United States kill a Gaza ceasefire resolution backed by fourteen of the fifteen members of the Security Council. Then she takes you into the corridors she walked for four years with a UN badge, working on Resolution 1325, the promise that women who live through a war should help decide how it ends. She follows what happened to the Afghan women she met there, and asks why, a quarter century later, women are still just 7 percent of peace negotiators. Underneath it all is one question: in that building, who actually gets to decide, and who only gets to watch? You can connect with Saadia on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠IG ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@itssaadiak⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Email:[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Host & Producer: Saadia Khan I Content Writer: Saadia Khan I Editorial Review: Shei Yu I Sound Designer & Editor: Lou Raskin I Immigrantly Theme Music: Simon Hutchinson | Other Music: Epidemic Sound Immigrantly Podcast is an Immigrantly Media Production. For advertising inquiries, contact us at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT (Belong On Your Own Terms) ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠is the next step. It’s our new app, designed to help you think through identity, culture, ambition, relationships, and the stories we carry with guided reflections, prompts, and frameworks developed over years of conversations on this show. It’s thoughtful. It’s challenging. And honestly, it’s the kind of space many of us wish existed earlier in our lives. If you’re ready to go deeper than the podcast, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and start the journey. Don't forget to subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Immigrantly Uninterrupted⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠for insightful podcasts. Follow us on social media for updates and behind-the-scenes content. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This is a rerun of Saadia's conversation with Mory Fontanez. Saadia found Mory on Instagram after Mory posted a video about her family in Iran during the June 2025 strikes. With the US now seven months into a new war with Iran, we're bringing this episode back. Mory is an intuitive life and leadership coach, a former crisis manager, and the author of Higher Self: Reclaiming the Power of Your Intuition. She and Saadia talk about whether fear and intuition can work together, why Eastern and Western cultures treat intuition so differently, and how CEOs are starting to use gut feelings in business. Saadia pushes back, and by the end she decides to try something new. Also from Immigrantly: 9/11 at 25 is now out in full, all three episodes. Start with Guantánamo. You can connect with Saadia on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠IG ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@itssaadiak⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Email:[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Host & Producer: Saadia Khan I Content Writer: Saadia Khan I Editorial review: Shei Yu I Sound Designer & Editor: Lou Raskin I Immigrantly Theme Music: Simon Hutchinson | Other Music: Epidemic Sound Immigrantly Podcast is an Immigrantly Media Production. For advertising inquiries, contact us at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT (Belong On Your Own Terms) ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠is the next step. It’s our new app, designed to help you think through identity, culture, ambition, relationships, and the stories we carry with guided reflections, prompts, and frameworks developed over years of conversations on this show. It’s thoughtful. It’s challenging. And honestly, it’s the kind of space many of us wish existed earlier in our lives. If you’re ready to go deeper than the podcast, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and start the journey. Don't forget to subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Immigrantly Uninterrupted⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠for insightful podcasts. Follow us on social media for updates and behind-the-scenes content. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week Saadia Khan brings back one of her favorite conversations of the year. Ramzi Fawaz has just relaunched his podcast, Nerd From the Future, for a second season, and the first new episode is out now. Ramzi is a professor of English at the University of Wisconsin-Madison and the author of The New Mutants and Queer Forms. His next book argues that the humanities can work like psychedelic therapy, using art, literature, and media instead of drugs to change how students see the world. When Saadia and Ramzi first spoke, everyone was panicking about young people. Why are they lonely, why are they cheating with ChatGPT, why are they drifting toward the manosphere. Almost none of those takes were coming from humanities professors, and Ramzi thinks that is a massive mistake. They also get into friendship as loving betrayal, resentment as something you negotiate rather than banish, and why the most abundant society in history has not made anyone happy. Also from Immigrantly: 9/11 at 25 is now out in full, all three episodes. Start with Guantánamo. You can connect with Saadia on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠IG ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@itssaadiak⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Email:[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Host & Producer: Saadia Khan I Content Writer: Saadia Khan I Editorial review: Shei Yu I Sound Designer & Editor: Lou Raskin I Immigrantly Theme Music: Simon Hutchinson | Other Music: Epidemic Sound Immigrantly Podcast is an Immigrantly Media Production. For advertising inquiries, contact us at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT (Belong On Your Own Terms) ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠is the next step. It’s our new app, designed to help you think through identity, culture, ambition, relationships, and the stories we carry with guided reflections, prompts, and frameworks developed over years of conversations on this show. It’s thoughtful. It’s challenging. And honestly, it’s the kind of space many of us wish existed earlier in our lives. If you’re ready to go deeper than the podcast, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and start the journey. Don't forget to subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Immigrantly Uninterrupted⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠for insightful podcasts. Follow us on social media for updates and behind-the-scenes content. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Three days before the 25th anniversary of September 11th, New York City released 170,000 pages of its own 9/11 records, and Mayor Zohran Mamdani made September 11th an official citywide day of remembrance and service. The first Muslim mayor of New York is doing more 9/11 accountability work than any mayor before him. Does that protect Muslims, or put them on trial again? In the final episode of Immigrantly's 9/11 at 25 series, host Saadia Khan sits down with Salam Al-Marayati, co-founder and president of the Muslim Public Affairs Council (MPAC). He was walking to the White House for a meeting with President George W. Bush on the morning of September 11, 2001, and has spent 38 years being called the reasonable Muslim by the government and the government's Muslim by his own community. Saadia asks the questions Muslim leaders rarely get asked on the record. Why did MPAC take part in Countering Violent Extremism programs, and does he regret Safe Spaces? Why does the US government list only Muslim groups as terrorists? Does the good Muslim narrative buy the community anything? Do Muslims have to show up every September? Al-Marayati argues that war, not Islam, is the real national security problem, and that human security has to replace the trillion-dollar version. This conversation covers the Patriot Act, post-9/11 surveillance, CVE, blowback, Islamophobia in 2026, and the Mamdani 9/11 records release. Find MPAC at mpac.org and on Instagram at MPAC National and MPAC Hollywood Bureau You can connect with Saadia on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠IG ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@itssaadiak⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Email:[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Host & Producer: Saadia Khan I Content Writer: Saadia Khan I Editorial review: Shei Yu I Sound Designer & Editor: Lou Raskin I Immigrantly Theme Music: Simon Hutchinson | Other Music: Epidemic Sound Immigrantly Podcast is an Immigrantly Media Production. For advertising inquiries, contact us at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT (Belong On Your Own Terms) ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠is the next step. It’s our new app, designed to help you think through identity, culture, ambition, relationships, and the stories we carry with guided reflections, prompts, and frameworks developed over years of conversations on this show. It’s thoughtful. It’s challenging. And honestly, it’s the kind of space many of us wish existed earlier in our lives. If you’re ready to go deeper than the podcast, subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BOYOT⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and start the journey. Don't forget to subscribe to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Immigrantly Uninterrupted⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠for insightful podcasts. Follow us on social media for updates and behind-the-scenes content. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices