<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Matt MacInnis &lt;/strong&gt;is the chief product officer and former longtime COO at Rippling, a unified workforce management platform valued at over $16 billion.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;We discuss:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;1. Why “extraordinary results demand extraordinary efforts”&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;2. Why you should deliberately understaff projects, and how to know when you’ve gone too far&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;3. Matt’s transition from COO to CPO and what surprised him about leading product&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;4. The “high alpha, low beta” framework for evaluating people, processes, and products&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;5. When founders should quit their startups (hint: much earlier than VCs want you to)&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;6. How to fight entropy in your organization through relentless energy and intensity&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Brought to you by:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a target="_blank" href="https://ai.dev/"&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Google Gemini&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;—Your everyday AI assistant: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://ai.dev/"&gt;https://ai.dev/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.datadoghq.com/lenny"&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Datadog&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;—Now home to Eppo, the leading experimentation and feature flagging platform: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.datadoghq.com/lenny"&gt;https://www.datadoghq.com/lenny&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a target="_blank" href="http://gofundme.com/lenny"&gt;&lt;strong&gt;GoFundMe Giving Funds&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;—Make year-end giving easy: &lt;a target="_blank" href="http://gofundme.com/lenny"&gt;http://gofundme.com/lenny&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Transcript:&lt;/strong&gt; &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/10-contrarian-leadership-truths"&gt;https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/10-contrarian-leadership-truths&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;My biggest takeaways (for paid newsletter subscribers):&lt;/strong&gt; &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/i/181916584/my-biggest-takeaways-from-this-conversation"&gt;https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/i/181916584/my-biggest-takeaways-from-this-conversation&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Where to find Matt MacInnis:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• X: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/stanine"&gt;https://x.com/stanine&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• LinkedIn: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/macinnis"&gt;https://www.linkedin.com/in/macinnis&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Email: &lt;a target="_blank" href="mailto:macinnis@rippling.com"&gt;macinnis@rippling.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Where to find Lenny:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Newsletter: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com"&gt;https://www.lennysnewsletter.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• X: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/lennysan"&gt;https://twitter.com/lennysan&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• LinkedIn: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/"&gt;https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;In this episode, we cover:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(00:00) Introduction to Matt MacInnis and Rippling&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(04:38) The importance of extraordinary efforts&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(08:37) The challenges and rewards of relentless effort&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(10:11) Your job as a leader is to preserve intensity&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(12:39) You learn far more from success than failure&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(16:34) Transitioning to chief product officer&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(19:54) Fixing product management at Rippling&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(25:27) The “high alpha, low beta” framework&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(28:55) The PQL framework&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(35:16) Hiring frameworks and team dynamics&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(36:52) A helpful interview tactic&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(40:00) Leading as a COO vs. a CPO&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(42:34) The reality of product-market fit&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(46:38) The problem with venture capital&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(49:29) When founders should quit their startups&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(41:48) The immutable market&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(54:13) Lessons from Notion’s success&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(57:43) Investment strategies and narrative violations&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(01:00:42) The power of compounding, power law, and entropy&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(01:07:02) Maintaining intensity and fighting entropy&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(01:11:33) The importance of feedback and escalations&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(01:14:31) Rippling’s vision and success&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(01:17:48) AI’s impact on SaaS and business software&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(01:23:42) AI corner&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;(01:26:23) Final thoughts and lightning round&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Referenced:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Rippling: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.rippling.com"&gt;https://www.rippling.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Sunil Raman on LinkedIn: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/sunilraman"&gt;https://www.linkedin.com/in/sunilraman&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Dan Gill on LinkedIn: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/dangill"&gt;https://www.linkedin.com/in/dangill&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Carvana: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.carvana.com"&gt;https://www.carvana.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Brian Chesky’s new playbook: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/brian-cheskys-contrarian-approach"&gt;https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/brian-cheskys-contrarian-approach&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Parker Conrad on LinkedIn: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/parkerconrad"&gt;https://www.linkedin.com/in/parkerconrad&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Inkling: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.inkling.com"&gt;https://www.inkling.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Akshay Kothari on LinkedIn: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/akothari"&gt;https://www.linkedin.com/in/akothari&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Notion: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.notion.com"&gt;https://www.notion.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Conway’s law: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conway%27s_law"&gt;https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conway%27s_law&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Seeking Alpha: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://seekingalpha.com"&gt;https://seekingalpha.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Dennis Rodman’s website: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://dennisrodman.com"&gt;https://dennisrodman.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Dancing pickle emoji: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://slackmojis.com/emojis/456-dancing_pickle"&gt;https://slackmojis.com/emojis/456-dancing_pickle&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Pickle Rick: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickle_Rick"&gt;https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickle_Rick&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• SPOTAK: The Six Traits I Look for When I’m Hiring: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://finance.yahoo.com/news/spotak-six-traits-look-m-181335267.html"&gt;https://finance.yahoo.com/news/spotak-six-traits-look-m-181335267.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Geoff Lewis on LinkedIn: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/geofflewis1"&gt;https://www.linkedin.com/in/geofflewis1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Zenefits: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TriNet_Zenefits"&gt;https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TriNet_Zenefits&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• New banking records prove Deel paid thief who stole trade secrets from Rippling: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.rippling.com/blog/new-banking-records-prove-deel-paid-thief-who-stole-trade-secrets-from-rippling"&gt;https://www.rippling.com/blog/new-banking-records-prove-deel-paid-thief-who-stole-trade-secrets-from-rippling&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Workday: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.workday.com"&gt;https://www.workday.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Matic robots: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://maticrobots.com"&gt;https://maticrobots.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• &lt;em&gt;Wall-E&lt;/em&gt;: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0910970"&gt;https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0910970&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Conviction: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.conviction.com"&gt;https://www.conviction.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Mike Vernal on X: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/mvernal"&gt;https://x.com/mvernal&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Sarah Guo on X: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/saranormous"&gt;https://x.com/saranormous&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• No Priors: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://linktr.ee/nopriors"&gt;https://linktr.ee/nopriors&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Gemini: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://gemini.google.com"&gt;https://gemini.google.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• ChatGPT: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://chatgpt.com"&gt;https://chatgpt.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Claude: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://claude.ai"&gt;https://claude.ai&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Bryan Schreier on LinkedIn: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/bryanschreier"&gt;https://www.linkedin.com/in/bryanschreier&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• &lt;em&gt;Heated Rivalry &lt;/em&gt;on HBO Max: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.hbomax.com/shows/heated-rivalry/50cd4e99-04ee-427b-a3b4-da721ed05d9c"&gt;https://www.hbomax.com/shows/heated-rivalry/50cd4e99-04ee-427b-a3b4-da721ed05d9c&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• Fellow coffee maker: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://fellowproducts.com/products/aiden-precision-coffee-maker"&gt;https://fellowproducts.com/products/aiden-precision-coffee-maker&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Recommended books:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• &lt;em&gt;Pale Blue Dot: A Vision of the Human Future in Space&lt;/em&gt;: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.amazon.com/Pale-Blue-Dot-Vision-Future/dp/0345376595"&gt;https://www.amazon.com/Pale-Blue-Dot-Vision-Future/dp/0345376595&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• &lt;em&gt;Conscious Business: How to Build Value Through Values&lt;/em&gt;: &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.amazon.com/Conscious-Business-Build-through-Values/dp/1622032020"&gt;https://www.amazon.com/Conscious-Business-Build-through-Values/dp/1622032020&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• &lt;em&gt;Thinking in Systems:&lt;/em&gt; &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-Systems-Donella-H-Meadows/dp/1603580557"&gt;https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-Systems-Donella-H-Meadows/dp/1603580557&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;• &lt;em&gt;The Effective Executive: The Definitive Guide to Getting the Right Things Done&lt;/em&gt;:&lt;em&gt; &lt;/em&gt;&lt;a target="_blank" href="https://www.amazon.com/Effective-Executive-Definitive-Harperbusiness-Essentials/dp/0060833459"&gt;https://www.amazon.com/Effective-Executive-Definitive-Harperbusiness-Essentials/dp/0060833459&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Production and marketing by &lt;a target="_blank" href="https://penname.co/"&gt;https://penname.co/&lt;/a&gt;. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email &lt;a target="_blank" href="mailto:podcast@lennyrachitsky.com"&gt;podcast@lennyrachitsky.com&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;—&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;em&gt;Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;To hear more, visit &lt;a href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com?utm_medium=podcast&amp;#38;utm_campaign=show-notes-no-free-preview-language"&gt;www.lennysnewsletter.com&lt;/a&gt;</description>

Lenny's Podcast: Product | Career | Growth

Lenny Rachitsky

10 contrarian leadership truths every leader needs to hear | Matt MacInnis (Rippling)

DEC 28, 202596 MIN
Lenny's Podcast: Product | Career | Growth

10 contrarian leadership truths every leader needs to hear | Matt MacInnis (Rippling)

DEC 28, 202596 MIN

Description

<p><strong>Matt MacInnis </strong>is the chief product officer and former longtime COO at Rippling, a unified workforce management platform valued at over $16 billion.</p><p></p><p><strong>We discuss:</strong></p><p>1. Why “extraordinary results demand extraordinary efforts”</p><p>2. Why you should deliberately understaff projects, and how to know when you’ve gone too far</p><p>3. Matt’s transition from COO to CPO and what surprised him about leading product</p><p>4. The “high alpha, low beta” framework for evaluating people, processes, and products</p><p>5. When founders should quit their startups (hint: much earlier than VCs want you to)</p><p>6. How to fight entropy in your organization through relentless energy and intensity</p><p>—</p><p><strong>Brought to you by:</strong></p><p><a target="_blank" href="https://ai.dev/"><strong>Google Gemini</strong></a>—Your everyday AI assistant: <a target="_blank" href="https://ai.dev/">https://ai.dev/</a></p><p><a target="_blank" href="https://www.datadoghq.com/lenny"><strong>Datadog</strong></a>—Now home to Eppo, the leading experimentation and feature flagging platform: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.datadoghq.com/lenny">https://www.datadoghq.com/lenny</a></p><p><a target="_blank" href="http://gofundme.com/lenny"><strong>GoFundMe Giving Funds</strong></a>—Make year-end giving easy: <a target="_blank" href="http://gofundme.com/lenny">http://gofundme.com/lenny</a></p><p>—</p><p><strong>Transcript:</strong> <a target="_blank" href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/10-contrarian-leadership-truths">https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/10-contrarian-leadership-truths</a></p><p>—</p><p><strong>My biggest takeaways (for paid newsletter subscribers):</strong> <a target="_blank" href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/i/181916584/my-biggest-takeaways-from-this-conversation">https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/i/181916584/my-biggest-takeaways-from-this-conversation</a></p><p>—</p><p><strong>Where to find Matt MacInnis:</strong></p><p>• X: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/stanine">https://x.com/stanine</a></p><p>• LinkedIn: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/macinnis">https://www.linkedin.com/in/macinnis</a></p><p>• Email: <a target="_blank" href="mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a></p><p>—</p><p><strong>Where to find Lenny:</strong></p><p>• Newsletter: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com">https://www.lennysnewsletter.com</a></p><p>• X: <a target="_blank" href="https://twitter.com/lennysan">https://twitter.com/lennysan</a></p><p>• LinkedIn: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/">https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/</a></p><p>—</p><p><strong>In this episode, we cover:</strong></p><p>(00:00) Introduction to Matt MacInnis and Rippling</p><p>(04:38) The importance of extraordinary efforts</p><p>(08:37) The challenges and rewards of relentless effort</p><p>(10:11) Your job as a leader is to preserve intensity</p><p>(12:39) You learn far more from success than failure</p><p>(16:34) Transitioning to chief product officer</p><p>(19:54) Fixing product management at Rippling</p><p>(25:27) The “high alpha, low beta” framework</p><p>(28:55) The PQL framework</p><p>(35:16) Hiring frameworks and team dynamics</p><p>(36:52) A helpful interview tactic</p><p>(40:00) Leading as a COO vs. a CPO</p><p>(42:34) The reality of product-market fit</p><p>(46:38) The problem with venture capital</p><p>(49:29) When founders should quit their startups</p><p>(41:48) The immutable market</p><p>(54:13) Lessons from Notion’s success</p><p>(57:43) Investment strategies and narrative violations</p><p>(01:00:42) The power of compounding, power law, and entropy</p><p>(01:07:02) Maintaining intensity and fighting entropy</p><p>(01:11:33) The importance of feedback and escalations</p><p>(01:14:31) Rippling’s vision and success</p><p>(01:17:48) AI’s impact on SaaS and business software</p><p>(01:23:42) AI corner</p><p>(01:26:23) Final thoughts and lightning round</p><p>—</p><p><strong>Referenced:</strong></p><p>• Rippling: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.rippling.com">https://www.rippling.com</a></p><p>• Sunil Raman on LinkedIn: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/sunilraman">https://www.linkedin.com/in/sunilraman</a></p><p>• Dan Gill on LinkedIn: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/dangill">https://www.linkedin.com/in/dangill</a></p><p>• Carvana: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.carvana.com">https://www.carvana.com</a></p><p>• Brian Chesky’s new playbook: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/brian-cheskys-contrarian-approach">https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/brian-cheskys-contrarian-approach</a></p><p>• Parker Conrad on LinkedIn: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/parkerconrad">https://www.linkedin.com/in/parkerconrad</a></p><p>• Inkling: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.inkling.com">https://www.inkling.com</a></p><p>• Akshay Kothari on LinkedIn: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/akothari">https://www.linkedin.com/in/akothari</a></p><p>• Notion: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.notion.com">https://www.notion.com</a></p><p>• Conway’s law: <a target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conway%27s_law">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conway%27s_law</a></p><p>• Seeking Alpha: <a target="_blank" href="https://seekingalpha.com">https://seekingalpha.com</a></p><p>• Dennis Rodman’s website: <a target="_blank" href="https://dennisrodman.com">https://dennisrodman.com</a></p><p>• Dancing pickle emoji: <a target="_blank" href="https://slackmojis.com/emojis/456-dancing_pickle">https://slackmojis.com/emojis/456-dancing_pickle</a></p><p>• Pickle Rick: <a target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickle_Rick">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickle_Rick</a></p><p>• SPOTAK: The Six Traits I Look for When I’m Hiring: <a target="_blank" href="https://finance.yahoo.com/news/spotak-six-traits-look-m-181335267.html">https://finance.yahoo.com/news/spotak-six-traits-look-m-181335267.html</a></p><p>• Geoff Lewis on LinkedIn: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/geofflewis1">https://www.linkedin.com/in/geofflewis1</a></p><p>• Zenefits: <a target="_blank" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TriNet_Zenefits">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TriNet_Zenefits</a></p><p>• New banking records prove Deel paid thief who stole trade secrets from Rippling: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.rippling.com/blog/new-banking-records-prove-deel-paid-thief-who-stole-trade-secrets-from-rippling">https://www.rippling.com/blog/new-banking-records-prove-deel-paid-thief-who-stole-trade-secrets-from-rippling</a></p><p>• Workday: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.workday.com">https://www.workday.com</a></p><p>• Matic robots: <a target="_blank" href="https://maticrobots.com">https://maticrobots.com</a></p><p>• <em>Wall-E</em>: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0910970">https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0910970</a></p><p>• Conviction: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.conviction.com">https://www.conviction.com</a></p><p>• Mike Vernal on X: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/mvernal">https://x.com/mvernal</a></p><p>• Sarah Guo on X: <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/saranormous">https://x.com/saranormous</a></p><p>• No Priors: <a target="_blank" href="https://linktr.ee/nopriors">https://linktr.ee/nopriors</a></p><p>• Gemini: <a target="_blank" href="https://gemini.google.com">https://gemini.google.com</a></p><p>• ChatGPT: <a target="_blank" href="https://chatgpt.com">https://chatgpt.com</a></p><p>• Claude: <a target="_blank" href="https://claude.ai">https://claude.ai</a></p><p>• Bryan Schreier on LinkedIn: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/bryanschreier">https://www.linkedin.com/in/bryanschreier</a></p><p>• <em>Heated Rivalry </em>on HBO Max: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.hbomax.com/shows/heated-rivalry/50cd4e99-04ee-427b-a3b4-da721ed05d9c">https://www.hbomax.com/shows/heated-rivalry/50cd4e99-04ee-427b-a3b4-da721ed05d9c</a></p><p>• Fellow coffee maker: <a target="_blank" href="https://fellowproducts.com/products/aiden-precision-coffee-maker">https://fellowproducts.com/products/aiden-precision-coffee-maker</a></p><p>—</p><p><strong>Recommended books:</strong></p><p>• <em>Pale Blue Dot: A Vision of the Human Future in Space</em>: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.amazon.com/Pale-Blue-Dot-Vision-Future/dp/0345376595">https://www.amazon.com/Pale-Blue-Dot-Vision-Future/dp/0345376595</a></p><p>• <em>Conscious Business: How to Build Value Through Values</em>: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.amazon.com/Conscious-Business-Build-through-Values/dp/1622032020">https://www.amazon.com/Conscious-Business-Build-through-Values/dp/1622032020</a></p><p>• <em>Thinking in Systems:</em> <a target="_blank" href="https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-Systems-Donella-H-Meadows/dp/1603580557">https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-Systems-Donella-H-Meadows/dp/1603580557</a></p><p>• <em>The Effective Executive: The Definitive Guide to Getting the Right Things Done</em>:<em> </em><a target="_blank" href="https://www.amazon.com/Effective-Executive-Definitive-Harperbusiness-Essentials/dp/0060833459">https://www.amazon.com/Effective-Executive-Definitive-Harperbusiness-Essentials/dp/0060833459</a></p><p>—</p><p>Production and marketing by <a target="_blank" href="https://penname.co/">https://penname.co/</a>. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email <a target="_blank" href="mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>.</p><p>—</p><p><em>Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.</em></p> <br/><br/>To hear more, visit <a href="https://www.lennysnewsletter.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=show-notes-no-free-preview-language">www.lennysnewsletter.com</a>