If you’re not getting cited by ChatGPT, your “AI SEO” strategy isn’t working, no matter what your dashboards say. Most of it is observability theater: dashboards, charts, synthetic prompts — and zero actual placement.In this episode, we chat with Shawn Schneider, founder of Eldil AI, about what actually determines whether your company shows up in ChatGPT answers. The short answer: LLMs don’t reward more content, clever prompts, or prettier dashboards. They reward a small set of trusted third-party sources — and most brands aren’t mentioned in any of them.Shawn breaks down why observability alone creates a false sense of progress, how to identify the specific citations that dominate your category, and how to turn that insight into real placements through outreach and negotiation. We also unpack why Google Search Console is still the best signal we have for AI-driven queries, how to prioritize the one citation that actually matters, and what the first 30–90 days can look like when you do this correctly.GuestShawn Schneider — founder of Eldil AI, a GEO / AI SEO platform focused on identifying and securing the citations LLMs rely on most; helps brands and agencies win visibility in ChatGPT by targeting the power-law sources that shape AI answers.Guest LinksLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shawn-schneider-61b2b5207/ Company Website: https://www.eldil.ai/What You’ll LearnWhy most GEO / AI SEO observability tools are meaningless without actual placements The only thing that reliably improves AI search visibility: citation placementsHow to use Google Search Console to surface AI fan-out queriesWhy synthetic prompt data is still unreliable (and what to trust instead)The power law of citations: why only 1–3 sources actually matterHow Eldil turns citation discovery into outreach and negotiated placementsWhat 30–90 days can look like when you secure the right citationWhich industries should invest heavily — and which should ignore this for nowWhy ChatGPT dominates referral traffic compared to other LLMsWhat happens when ads arrive inside AI search resultsTimestamps00:00 — GEO, AI SEO, AEO: noise vs. reality00:21 — Why observability tools don’t move the needle03:55 — Where GEO tools get their data (and why it’s messy)07:16 — Using Google Search Console as a prompt proxy09:40 — The three pillars: technical, content, authority12:07 — Citations as the dominant ranking lever13:07 — The power law: thousands of citations, one winner19:07 — How fast results actually show up20:39 — When building your own citation content makes sense30:41 — Which business models win with GEO37:11 — ChatGPT ads and the future of AI search41:32 — Where to find Shawn and closing thoughts Key Topics & Ideas1. Why dashboards feel good but don’t create outcomes.Most tools are essentially “Google Analytics for LLMs”ChatGPT referrals rise naturally as usage increasesCharts go up even if you do nothingWithout placements, observability is just vanity2. The three common approaches in the market today:Guessing prompts with LLMsClickstream data sourced from Chrome extensions and brokersSynthetic prompts without transparencyEldil uses Google Search Console + Analytics as the best available proxy for real intent.3. How to spot AI-generated fan-out queries:50+ character queriesHigh impressionsLow or zero clicksThese often represent LLMs expanding short prompts into long-form searches.4. The three pillars: Technical, Content, AuthorityTechnical — can an LLM crawl and understand your site?Content — does useful information exist?Authority — does anyone credible back it up?Authority is the multiplier most teams ignore.5. What actually shapes AI answers:Citations are not backlinks, they are semantic explanationsLLMs repeatedly return to the same trusted sourcesThird-party listicles and niche blogs dominate citation share6. The Power Law of Citations10k–15k citations may exist200–300 matter1–3 actually move the needleIf you’re not in those, content volume won’t save you.7. The real workflow:Identify high-value customer questionsExtract dominant citationsRank them by weightContact site ownersNegotiate placementMonitor AI visibility and referral trafficThis is where most tools stop — and where Eldil focuses.8. How many placements do you need?Surprisingly few.You don’t need 100 placementsYou need the right oneThen expand into adjacent verticalsThis is concentrated betting, not spray-and-pray SEO.9. Why GEO feels different from traditional SEO:You are inserting into sources that already rankChanges can show up in weeks, not yearsMeaningful referral growth often appears within ~60–90 days10. Who Should (and Shouldn’t) Do ThisBest fit:High-ACV B2B SaaSLong buying cyclesHigh-LTV e-commerce (supplements, skincare)ICPs that already live in ChatGPTIf your customers do not use LLMs yet, start elsewhere.11. Why ChatGPT is the main eventBased on Eldil’s data:ChatGPT referrals dwarf Perplexity and othersFor most companies, this is where focus belongsSmaller channels still matter for high-ticket sales12. What’s coming nextPaid placements inside LLMsOrganic plus paid becoming a one-two punchCitation inventory getting expensive fastThe window for cheap dominance will not last.SponsorToday’s episode is brought to you by Graphed – an AI data analyst & BI platform.With Graphed you can:Connect data like GA4, Facebook Ads, HubSpot, Google Ads, Search Console, AmplitudeBuild interactive dashboards just by chatting (no Looker Studio/Tableau learning curve)Use it as your ETL + data warehouse + BI layer in one placeAsk:“Build me a stacked bar chart of new users vs. all users over time from GA4”…and Graphed just builds it for you.👉 Get a free trial worth $500 plus a personal discovery call to set up your first dashboard: https://graphed.com/