The Retort AI Podcast

<p>An exciting week for Tom, who tells Nate about his company Hortus AI, whose mission is to make AI accountable to local communities. We cover a lot of classic Retort themes as Tom makes a case for what's missing from AI development, and how models could be more healthily integrated into everyday people's lives.</p><p>Press release: <a href="https://hortus.ai/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/Hortus-AI-Press-Release_Feb25.pdf" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://hortus.ai/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/Hortus-AI-Press-Release_Feb25.pdf</a><br/>Company website: <a href="https://hortus.ai/" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://hortus.ai/</a><br/>Link to whitepaper: <a href="https://www.newamerica.org/rethinkai/policy-papers/a-sustainable-path-for-ai-development/">https://www.newamerica.org/rethinkai/policy-papers/a-sustainable-path-for-ai-development/</a></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://www.retortai.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">www.retortai.com</a>

<p>Tom and Nate sit down for a classic discussion of the role of AI in the modern philosophy of science. Much of this discussion is based on Thomas Samuel Kuhn's influential book <em>The Structure of Scientific Revolutions</em>. We ask -- is AI a science in the Kuhn'ian sense? Will the "paradigm" worldview apply to other sciences post AI? How will scientific institutions manage the addition of AI?</p><p>We promised an AI for science reading list, so here it is:</p><ul><li><a href="https://youtu.be/ugvHCXCOmm4?si=1hnlvue8M4pV2TqC">[Dario interview with Lex]</a> <a href="https://youtu.be/ugvHCXCOmm4?si=1hnlvue8M4pV2TqC">https://youtu.be/ugvHCXCOmm4?si=1hnlvue8M4pV2TqC</a></li><li><a href="https://open.substack.com/pub/cell/p/levers?r=68gy5&amp;utm_medium=ios">Levers for biological progress</a> <a href="https://open.substack.com/pub/cell/p/levers?r=68gy5&amp;utm_medium=ios">https://open.substack.com/pub/cell/p/levers?r=68gy5&amp;utm_medium=ios</a></li><li><a href="https://x.com/AdamMarblestone/status/1845158919523664019">X thread on theories of change in scienceshttps://x.com/AdamMarblestone/status/1845158919523664019</a></li><li>whitepaper linked by seb krier</li><li>Dwarkesh physics pod <a href="https://open.substack.com/pub/dwarkesh/p/adam-brown?r=68gy5&amp;utm_medium=ios">https://open.substack.com/pub/dwarkesh/p/adam-brown?r=68gy5&amp;utm_medium=ios</a> — Nobel in physics went to ai</li><li>Ai policy perspectives piece <a href="https://www.aipolicyperspectives.com/p/a-new-golden-age-of-discovery"><em>A new golden age of discovery</em>https://www.aipolicyperspectives.com/p/a-new-golden-age-of-discovery</a></li><li>Owl posting checking recent NeurIPS papers <a href="https://www.owlposting.com/p/can-o1-preview-find-major-mistakes">https://www.owlposting.com/p/can-o1-preview-find-major-mistakes</a> based on idea from Ethan Mollick <a href="https://x.com/emollick/status/1868329599438037491">https://x.com/emollick/status/1868329599438037491</a></li><li>also another post on the subject <a href="https://open.substack.com/pub/amistrongeryet/p/the-black-spatula-project?r=68gy5&amp;utm_medium=ios">https://open.substack.com/pub/amistrongeryet/p/the-black-spatula-project?r=68gy5&amp;utm_medium=ios</a></li><li>Kuhn’s <em>The Structure of Scientific Revolutions</em></li><li>intrinsic perspective <a href="https://open.substack.com/pub/erikhoel/p/great-scientists-follow-intuition?r=68gy5&amp;utm_medium=ios">https://open.substack.com/pub/erikhoel/p/great-scientists-follow-intuition?r=68gy5&amp;utm_medium=ios</a></li></ul><p>Get The Retort (<a href="https://retortai.com/)…" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://retortai.com/)…</a><br/>… on YouTube: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/@TheRetortAIPodcast" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/@TheRetortAIPodcast</a><br/>… on Spotify: <a href="https://open.spotify.com/show/0FDjH8ujv7p8ELZGkBvrfv?si=fa17a4d408f245ee" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://open.spotify.com/show/0FDjH8ujv7p8ELZGkBvrfv?si=fa17a4d408f245ee</a><br/>… on Apple Podcasts: <a href="https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-retort-ai-podcast/id1706223190" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-retort-ai-podcast/id1706223190</a><br/>… Follow Interconnects: <a href="https://www.interconnects.ai/" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://www.interconnects.ai/</a><br/>… email us: <a href="mailto:[email protected]" class="linkified">[email protected]</a></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://www.retortai.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">www.retortai.com</a>

<p>We're back! Tom and Nate catch up after the Thanksgiving holiday. Our main question was -- what were the biggest AI stories of the year? We touch on the core themes of the show: infrastructure, AI realities, and and antitrust. The power buildout to scale out AI is going to have very real long-term impacts.</p><p>Some links this week:<br/>* Ben Thompson's, The End of the Beginning: <a href="https://stratechery.com/2020/the-end-of-the-beginning/" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://stratechery.com/2020/the-end-of-the-beginning/</a><br/>* Miles Brundage's Substack: <a href="https://milesbrundage.substack.com/p/why-im-leaving-openai-and-what-im" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://milesbrundage.substack.com/p/why-im-leaving-openai-and-what-im</a><br/>* Stochastic Parrots paper: <a href="https://dl.acm.org/doi/10.1145/3442188.3445922" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://dl.acm.org/doi/10.1145/3442188.3445922</a></p><p>Thanks for listening! </p><p>Get The Retort (<a href="https://retortai.com/)…" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://retortai.com/)…</a><br/>… on YouTube: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/@TheRetortAIPodcast" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/@TheRetortAIPodcast</a><br/>… on Spotify: <a href="https://open.spotify.com/show/0FDjH8ujv7p8ELZGkBvrfv?si=fa17a4d408f245ee" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://open.spotify.com/show/0FDjH8ujv7p8ELZGkBvrfv?si=fa17a4d408f245ee</a><br/>… on Apple Podcasts: <a href="https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-retort-ai-podcast/id1706223190" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-retort-ai-podcast/id1706223190</a><br/>… Follow Interconnects: <a href="https://www.interconnects.ai/" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://www.interconnects.ai/</a><br/>… email us: <a href="mailto:[email protected]" class="linkified">[email protected]</a></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://www.retortai.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">www.retortai.com</a>

<p>Tom and Nate catch up on the happenings in AI. Of course, we're focused on the biggest awards available to us as esteemed scientists (or something close enough) -- the Nobel Prizes! What does it mean in the trajectory of AI for Hinton and Hassabis to carry added scientific weight. Honestly, feels like a sinking ship. </p><p>Some links:<br/>* Schmidhuber tweet: <a href="https://x.com/SchmidhuberAI/status/1844022724328394780" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://x.com/SchmidhuberAI/status/1844022724328394780</a><br/>* Hinton "I'm proud my student fired Sam": <a href="https://x.com/Grady_Booch/status/1844145422824243290" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://x.com/Grady_Booch/status/1844145422824243290</a></p><p>00:00 Introduction<br/>04:43 Criticism of AI-related Nobel Prize awards<br/>09:06 Geoffrey Hinton's comments on winning the Nobel Prize<br/>18:14 Debate on who should be credited for current AI advancements<br/>25:53 Changes in the nature of scientific research and recognition<br/>34:44 Changes in AI safety culture and company dynamics<br/>37:27 Discussion on AI scaling and its impact on the industry<br/>42:21 Reflection on the ongoing AI hype cycle</p><p>Retort on YouTube: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/@TheRetortAIPodcast" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/@TheRetortAIPodcast</a><br/>Retort on Twitter: <a href="https://x.com/retortai" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://x.com/retortai</a><br/>Retort website: <a href="https://retortai.com/" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://retortai.com/</a><br/>Retort email: mail at retortai dot com</p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://www.retortai.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">www.retortai.com</a>

<p>Tom and Nate catch up on recent events (before the OpenAI o1 release) and opportunities in transparency/policy. We recap the legendary scam of Matt from IT department, why disclosing the outcomes of process is not enough, and more. This is a great episode on understanding why the process technology was birthed from is just as important as the outcome!</p><p>Some links:<br/>* Nathan's post on Model Specs for regulation <a href="https://www.interconnects.ai/p/a-post-training-approach-to-ai-regulation" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://www.interconnects.ai/p/a-post-training-approach-to-ai-regulation</a><br/>* Nathan's post on inference spend <a href="https://www.interconnects.ai/p/openai-strawberry-and-inference-scaling-laws" class="linkified" target="_blank">https://www.interconnects.ai/p/openai-strawberry-and-inference-scaling-laws</a></p><p>Send your questions to mail at retortai dot com</p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://www.retortai.com?utm_medium=podcast&#38;utm_campaign=CTA_1">www.retortai.com</a>