What We Don't Know with Matt Brittin & Hayaatun Sillem

Awards, AI, Co-CEOs & Loyalty | What We Don't Know Watercooler Hayaatun and Jimmy pull up a chair at the coffee machine to catch up on what's been catching their eye - the City AM Awards, The Devil Wears Prada 2, a controversial Airbnb CEO interview, and your questions on noise, loyalty, and whether AI will swamp the best human ideas. Timestamps 00:00 Welcome to the coffee machine 00:45 Are awards overrated, or do we actually need them? 02:00 The UK startups that got away: why the post-pandemic story isn't as bleak as you think 04:00 The Devil Wears Prada 2 and what pop culture gets right about loving hard work 05:30 Brian Chesky personally hires Airbnb's top 200 — genius or quietly disempowering? 08:30 Co-CEOs: bold leadership model or recipe for confusion? 12:00 Q from Flora: how do you find the signal in the noise? 16:30 Q from the comments: how long should you stay loyal to an organisation? 19:30 Q from Ken: will a billion AI ideas drown out the one great human one? 22:30 See you next time Resource: 🎙️ Brian Chesky: AI Founder Mode — Invest Like the Best with Patrick O'Shaughnessy — https://colossus.com/episode/ai-founder-mode/ 📰 Pilita Clark: Why co-CEOs might suit our tumultuous times (FT / Irish Times) — https://www.irishtimes.com/business/2026/05/04/why-co-ceos-might-suit-our-tumultuous-times/ 📖 Reid Hoffman: Tours of Duty — The New Employer-Employee Compact (HBR) — https://hbr.org/2013/06/tours-of-duty-the-new-employer-employee-compact Episodes mentioned: ▶️ Mark Read — Leading 22,000 Employees Who Bet Against You: https://youtu.be/O6oWoVf5X3I ▶️ Natasha Frangos — The Imposter Feeling Every Leader Faces: https://youtu.be/a9AHf_pMHgg ▶️ Sharon White — Why The Best Leaders Are Impossible to Read: https://youtu.be/JluTfnfJYD4 📧 Send us thoughts and questions at [email protected] 💼 Follow us on socials!: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/whatwedontknow.pod/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/what-we-dont-know-podcast/ Jimmy's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimmy-mcloughlin-obe/ Hayaatun's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hayaatun/ Credits: Producer: Sunny Winter Producer: Thuy Dong Producer: Jimmy McLoughlin OBE Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome to What We Don't Know with Matt Brittin & Hayaatun Sillem. The show about better leadership in a truly chaotic world. Across the series, episodes are joined a range of other leading figures, bringing different perspectives to each conversation. Subscribe to not miss an episode! ▶️ ⚡️ Powered by Boxlight.io https://www.boxlight.io/ ------ This week, Hayaatun is joined by Jimmy McLoughlin OBE, host of ⁨@jimmysjobs⁩ , to welcome Baroness Sharon White. Sharon White traces her journey from a working-class East London childhood — daughter of Windrush generation parents who left school at 11 and 14 — through 26 years as one of Whitehall's most senior but deliberately invisible civil servants, to leading OFCOM and later the John Lewis Partnership through COVID and financial turbulence. She shares why being impossible to read became a strategic asset, how the insider/outsider experience of growing up as a minority shaped her willingness to hold unpopular positions, and why she believes the problems facing political leaders today are categorically harder than a generation ago. She reflects on what it takes to lead 80,000 partners through a democratic business structure unlike anything in the private sector, why a reluctant regulator is a better regulator, and how to tell the difference between noise and what's actually real when everything feels urgent. She also discusses building crisis-ready teams before the crisis hits, the leadership skill she thinks nobody talks about enough — and what her teenage son taught her about inclusion. Timestamps: 00:00 Intro 01:38 Introducing Sharon White 03:56 What To Expect Today 04:30 Backstage At Number 10 06:53 Politics In The Social Media Age 08:36 Childhood And Immigrant Roots 13:43 Finding Her Voice 20:02 Purpose Across Career Switches 29:03 Earning Trust In New Worlds 32:50 Becoming Public Facing 36:40 Reluctant Regulator Mindset 40:28 Partnership Democracy Model 41:12 Customer Love and Stakeholders 43:20 Employee Ownership Pride 45:25 Resilience and Gratitude Mindset 47:30 Growth Needs Brave Leadership 51:12 Leading Through Constant Crises 53:07 Parenthood and Inclusion Lessons 56:18 Bravery and De Klerk Story 59:05 Quickfire Leadership Questions 01:01:33 Hosts Reflect on Key Takeaways 01:07:33 Duolingo Taxi Hiring Test 01:11:54 Meta AI Leader Avatars Debate 01:14:12 Wrap Up and Stay Connected Credits: Producer: Sunny Winter Producer: Thuy Dong Producer: Jimmy McLoughlin OBE Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

From Apartheid to Ubuntu: Paul’s Journey with Mandela, Tutu & the Truth Commission Welcome to What We Don't Know with Matt Brittin & Hayaatun Sillem. The show about better leadership in a truly chaotic world. Across the series, episodes are hosted by Matt and Hayaatun as well as a range of other leading figures, bringing different perspectives to each conversation. Subscribe to not miss an episode! ▶️ ⚡️ Powered by Boxlight.io https://www.boxlight.io/ ------ Paul recounts growing up white in apartheid South Africa with parents who opposed the regime, joining the anti-apartheid student movement, working on death penalty cases for a young black lawyer who was assassinated, and helping victims’ families build Kule Manni. At 26 he helped develop the Truth and Reconciliation Commission law and became its executive secretary under Archbishop Tutu, sharing leadership lessons about preserving opponents’ dignity and Mandela’s openness to hearing testimony about ANC abuses. He discusses empathy and Ubuntu as foundations for resilient societies, the role of information ecosystems and economic breakdown in modern polarization, and ways to embed Ubuntu in organizational culture. He describes the personal toll of trauma, later scaling transitional justice support globally by offering comparative experience rather than prescriptions, and founding London’s Conduit to convene coalitions tackling complex challenges like UK flooding. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Positive Leadership in a Chaotic World: Natasha Frangos on Culture, Growth, and Leading a Partnership Welcome to What We Don't Know with Matt Brittin & Hayaatun Sillem. The show about better leadership in a truly chaotic world. Across the series, episodes are hosted by Matt and Hayaatun as well as a range of other leading figures, bringing different perspectives to each conversation. Subscribe to not miss an episode! ▶️ ⚡️ Powered by Boxlight.io https://www.boxlight.io/ ------ Recorded at the Anthropy Conference at the Eden Project in Cornwall, Hayaatun interviews Natasha Frangos, managing partner of accountancy firm Haysmac, about leading with energy, authenticity, and optimism amid industry headwinds. Natasha shares how her Greek Cypriot upbringing, resilient grandmother, and accountant father shaped her leadership and view of trusted advisory relationships. She traces her path from leading the firm’s Creative Media & Tech sector to a firm-wide corporate role during COVID, then being elected as the firm’s first female managing partner in its first contested election. We cover partnership leadership and governance, culture as a driver of growth, developing and retaining homegrown talent, mentoring outside the sector, AI and automation strategy, competing as a mid-tier firm, staying independent amid PE consolidation, and sustaining energy through family, yoga, and theatre. 00:00 First Female Managing Partner 00:33 Rainforest Podcast Setup 02:27 Natasha Role Overview 03:47 Family Roots and Resilience 08:18 Ambition and Peer Support 09:45 Ant Trail Interlude 10:14 First Leadership Sector Focus 12:22 Founder Lessons and Investors 15:29 COVID Board Leadership 18:03 Chief Herder of Cats 19:47 Election and Imposter Feelings 23:03 Mentors and Outside Perspective 24:37 Growth Is Never Done 25:43 Creating Shared Momentum 27:31 People Over Numbers 29:24 Defining Culture In Practice 31:49 AI Anxiety And Upskilling 34:51 Mid Size Edge And Partnerships 37:22 Staying Energized As Leader 39:03 Role Model Pressure And Legacy 41:53 Big Priorities For The Year 44:25 Quickfire Leadership Round 47:50 Consolidation And Career Loyalty 51:25 West London And Final Takeaways 53:59 Closing Reflections And Wrap Credits: Producer: Sunny Winter Producer: Thuy Dong Producer: Jimmy McLoughlin OBE Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Time Management for Leaders: The 4Ds, Being Present, and Making Busy Work Matter Welcome to What We Don't Know with Matt Brittin & Hayaatun Sillem. The show about better leadership in a truly chaotic world. Across the series, episodes are hosted by Matt and Hayaatun as well as a range of other leading figures, bringing different perspectives to each conversation. Subscribe to not miss an episode! ▶️ ⚡️ Powered by Boxlight.io https://www.boxlight.io/ Hayaatun and Matt explore why leaders obsess over time and how choices, not sheer scarcity, shape outcomes. They discuss practical tools for overload, including Hayaatun’s “4Ds” (delegate, delay, drop, do), getting worries out of your head and into reliable systems (quadrant to-do lists, calendars, colored pens), and tackling the scariest task first to reduce stress. Hayaatun shares formative lessons from the high-pressure pace of the House of Commons and the value of trusted teamwork, while Matt reflects on preparing for leadership “set pieces,” using low-meeting days, processing time (commutes), and block time for deep work. They cover signals leaders send through calendars, the importance of hiring and tough conversations, meeting waste, and why sleep matters despite occasional crunches. 00:00 Zombie Consultants Intro 00:33 Time Choices Question 01:32 Meet The Hosts 02:09 Leader Time Signals 04:30 Four Ds Framework 06:10 Drop And Do 08:30 Quadrant List System 12:07 House Of Commons Pace 16:40 Fast Drafting Lesson 20:02 Prepared CEO Style 22:54 Safety Valves And Fridays 24:47 Calendar As Choices 27:02 Sauna Politician Aside 27:49 PhD Roots Of Time 29:01 Overwhelm And Fear 29:41 Do Scary Thing First 30:52 PhD Stress Triggers 32:20 Emotions As Data 34:19 Peak Hours Block Time 35:23 Travel Energy Management 37:42 Busy Leader Signals 40:48 What Leaders Cant Delegate 43:53 Chunk Time Strategy 46:16 Calendar And Team Alignment 51:15 Time Audits And Meetings 53:56 Sleep And Crunch Times 56:36 Key Takeaways On Time Management Credits: Producer: Sunny Winter Producer: Thuy Dong Producer: Jimmy McLoughlin OBE Post Producer: Ben Alexander Kippen Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices