Smashing the Plateau

Melanie focuses on practical data science and AI. Her career highlights include driving client outcomes at Petsch Analytics, LLC—her data science consultancy; designing and building custom applications with generative AI and large language models, incorporating humans in the loop, at Palantir Technologies; modeling and analyzing truly big data at the New York Stock Exchange; writing quantitative research and a book on commodity investing at Goldman Sachs; teaching at Columbia’s School of International and Public Affairs (SIPA); and serving on the Mechanical Engineering Advisory Council at Purdue University.

In today’s episode of Smashing the Plateau, you will learn how to reframe uncertainty, communicate value clearly, and turn vague requests into staged projects that produce quick wins.

Melanie and I discuss:

• Melanie’s career journey and pivotal transitions [01:54]
• How the 2008 crisis led to launching her consultancy and landing an eight-year anchor client [03:21]
• Employee vs. consultant mindsets and why she’s ambivalent about the labels [05:24]
• Teaching students to handle ambiguity and have honest client conversations [07:40]
• Why open, candid dialogue can be easier as a consultant [09:37]
• A mindset shift for corporate refugees to attract the next right clients [13:47]
• Identifying your highest-value skills and applying them to modern needs like generative AI [14:13]
• Communicating with nontechnical stakeholders and using mockups to align quickly [16:50]
• “That’s not my data” — using anomalies to improve data quality and trust [18:05]
• Feedback that matters and the power of meeting audiences where they are (data dictionary story) [19:08]
• The networking story of earning an eight-year client by not hiring someone [21:24]
• Human-first relationships vs. transactional interactions [23:30]
• How to connect with Melanie [24:29]

Michael Himmelfarb is the founder of HG Partners, a consulting firm that advises growing tech companies on monetization and go-to-market strategy. He developed a unique consulting model that combines the advantages of AI with the human superpowers of creativity, empathy, and experience to deliver high-impact results in as little as 48 hours. A former GM of a $200M Nielsen business and a five-time tech CXO, he is passionate about teaching consultants how to leverage AI without losing the human trust advantage. His blog, Reframing Forward, explores the future of AI-enhanced business and work.

In today’s episode of Smashing the Plateau, you will learn how to use value-based pricing, quick-win offers, and authentic relationship-building to stand out, earn attention, and convert conversations into paid work in a risk-averse market.

Michael and I discuss:

• Michael’s path from corporate leadership to independent consulting [01:49]
• A clear one-sentence offer grounded in value-based pricing [06:24]
• How to capture attention with show-don’t-tell executive summaries and easy-to-buy offers [07:11]
• Why trust beats automation: using AI with human oversight (and a cautionary math example) [10:47]
• Practical advice for consultants struggling to convert interest into revenue [12:12]
• A simple LinkedIn strategy: thoughtful comments that spark real conversations [12:49]
• Community, collaboration, and helping others as a growth engine [14:23]
• Drawing the line between giving value and getting paid (share in the upside) [15:52]
• Cutting through noise: do your own work, use AI for augmentation, quantify outcomes [17:15]
• Shaping the offer: transactional, advisory, recurring, or loss leader—staying flexible [18:54]
• An agile, iterative approach to prompts and analysis for better AI outcomes [20:51]
• The long game of relationships and radical transparency [21:40]
• Where to explore more of Michael’s ideas and connect [23:12]

Jonny Cooper spent 12 years as a professional musician, touring the world as a pianist before realizing he didn’t want to be broke forever and transitioning into sales. He gained experience selling home improvements, houseboats, hot tubs, and holidays, among other ventures, before building a financial services firm from scratch and scaling it to £10.2 million in turnover prior to selling it to a PLC. 

He then spent a decade in corporate consulting, working with clients such as Aston Martin, Optical Express, Argos, and many others. In 2017, he launched Everyone Hates Marketing, growing it into a 7,500-member Facebook community, and went on to train over 1,200 coaches, therapists, and consultants to launch their own online businesses. In May 2024, Jonny launched CIB to help consultants secure lucrative corporate engagements, and he now works exclusively with a select group of individuals within the CIB community.

In today’s episode of Smashing the Plateau, you will learn how to leverage your experience for corporate consulting success and develop a mindset for continuous growth.

Jonny and I discuss:

• How Jonny navigated career pivots, from music to financial services to consulting [01:42]
• The pivotal moment that pushed Jonny to seek new opportunities [01:58]
• Lessons in scaling and selling a service-based business [04:22]
• Why consultative selling is critical for landing corporate clients [10:31]
• The questions you should ask to connect with decision makers [11:10]
• How to use data-driven insights to break through the noise and win contracts [14:23]
• The role of community and peer support for consultants [18:16]
• How to build intentional, high-value communities [20:45]
• The importance of maintaining a growth mindset in your entrepreneurial journey [22:32]
• Jonny’s advice for adapting to new challenges and technologies [23:15]

David Jenyns is a serial entrepreneur, systems devotee, and founder of SYSTEMology, a company dedicated to helping business owners worldwide scale and streamline their operations. With over 20 years of experience in franchising, digital marketing, and business strategy, Jenyns has established himself as a trusted leader in the industry.

After successfully systemizing his own digital agency in 2016, Jenyns turned his attention to helping others achieve the same level of success. He founded SYSTEMology, which offers a proven seven-step process for managing clients and implementing systems in businesses. Today, his mission is to empower business owners to work on their businesses, not in them.

Through his workshops, keynote addresses, and his podcast, Business Processes Simplified, Jenyns has helped thousands of business owners achieve exponential growth and success. He is a passionate advocate for leveraging systems to simplify and streamline business operations, and his commitment to excellence has earned him the trust and admiration of clients and peers alike.

In today’s episode of Smashing the Plateau, you will learn how to harness systems thinking and the power of AI to free yourself from daily operations and build a business that truly works for you.

David Andrew and I discuss:

• The story behind his new book, Systems Champion [00:03:16]
• How AI rapidly transformed his business and team [00:03:32]
• The critical role of the “systems and AI champion” [00:05:21]
• How to spot and develop systems champions in your organization [00:06:10]
• The soft skills that matter most for systems champions [00:10:58]
• The challenge of decision-making in times of rapid change [00:15:34]
• Ways systems champions help leaders make better decisions [00:17:55]
• The power of community for systems professionals [00:19:41]
• Why systems-driven businesses are better for everyone [00:21:16]

Todd Cherches is the CEO and co-founder of BigBlueGumball, a NYC-based leadership and executive coaching firm. He is a member of Marshall Goldsmith’s “MG 100 Coaches,” a three-time award-winning adjunct professor of leadership at NYU, a lecturer on leadership at Columbia University, a TEDx speaker, and the author of the groundbreaking book, "VisuaLeadership: Leveraging the Power of Visual Thinking in Leadership and in Life."

In today’s episode of Smashing the Plateau, you will learn how to leverage relationships, community, and visual thinking to build a thriving business after leaving the corporate world.

Todd and I discuss:

• What led Todd to start his own business [02:47]
• Key challenges in balancing business development and client work [03:32]
• The importance of relationships and community for business growth [04:21]
• How teaching, speaking, and content creation fuel relationship building [05:22]
• Keeping relationships warm over time—especially for introverts [06:36]
• Using LinkedIn to nurture your network [06:36]
• The power of metaphors, analogies, and visual leadership for entrepreneurs [10:16]
• Four ways to communicate ideas visually [11:14]
• How visual thinking helps corporate refugees stand out [15:53]
• Becoming a resource for organizations in a VUCA world [16:55]
• Todd’s “four G’s” philosophy for leadership and community [22:14]
• How to start building your network and why it’s never too late [24:19]

Learn more about Todd at: